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Thread: My Towncars a smoking

  1. #1
    Senior Member kslust's Avatar
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    Default My Towncars a smoking

    Alright today, I was doing a photo shoot on my cars and the cars were idling quite a bit and I noticed something, and now have to ask if anyone has experienced this in their town cars????

    Car Idling for about 10-15 minutes pulls away and smokes light blue (obviously oil)?!?!?! Tried it later and can only get it to smoke after idling, not while driving and not right after starting.

    My initial thought. PCV Valve, anybody??? (I hope. cheapest solution)

    Rings - Car would smoke all the time (very rare in town cars, unless abused and severly overheated)
    Valve Guide Seals - would smoke at start as well???
    O2 Sensors - Just replaced them.

    I am not totally sure on this, any input would be great. Thanks!!!
    Very Respectfully,

    Karl S. Lust

    Regal Limousine & Transportation
    Kansas City, Missouri

    "If you've ever traveled this good,
    Welcome Back!"


    Kansas City Limo - Kansas City Airport Transportation

  2. #2
    Senior Member Bigdan's Avatar
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    Could be bad fuel burn too, have you run any injector cleaner? If you havent in a while I would suggest seafoam with full tank.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Elegant Limousines of Palm Coast's Avatar
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    The reason you are seeing blue smoke is you are burning oil. What has happened is your valve seals have shrunk and are allowing oil to pass into the cylinder and burn the oil. Doing Valve seals on the 4.6 can be a pain. But before you do that try this first. If you are using a light oil like 5w20 or 5w30 jump up to 10w30 and use Lucas oil stabilizer. Try this for about the next 2 oil changes and see if it gets better. The Lucas should soften up the seals and help them to swell back up. If it works use Lucas on every oil change. We have on every car. Our sedan has 315,000 miles now and no blue smoke. Hope this helps good luck.

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    Senior Member Bigdan's Avatar
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    I have to agree with kalust, if it were the seals it should smoke alot at startup.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Bigdan's Avatar
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    Crazy idea: kslust, do you use pennzoil or quakerstate? If not, try the seafoam. It will clean something weather it is injector, intake, valves, ect, it will benifit your engine.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Elegant Limousines of Palm Coast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigdan View Post
    I have to agree with kalust, if it were the seals it should smoke alot at startup.
    Not true. If an engine sits over night where is the oil ?? In the bottom of the oil pan. So how can it get past the valve seals over night when they are in the cylinder head at the top of the engine. When an engine idles the oil will build up in the valve train area. This will allow oil to slip past the seals then burn off when you step on the gas. It it was a fuel problem or dirty injectors the smoke would not be blue.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Party Bus Andy's Avatar
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    You can also switch to synthetic oil, and like elegant said a heavier grade with Lucas. With synthetic you will still burn some oil but instead of the smoke you will have an almost odorless vapor.
    Andy
    937-620-9120
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Bigdan's Avatar
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    When you shut the engine off, the oil doesn't magically drop to the oil pan, it is still on top of the seal and drips onto the piston causing blue smoke at startup. Unless you are talking about a flathead but I cant recall any of those being manufactured recently.
    Last edited by Bigdan; May 31st, 2012 at 08:08 AM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegant Limousines of Palm Coast View Post
    The reason you are seeing blue smoke is you are burning oil. What has happened is your valve seals have shrunk and are allowing oil to pass into the cylinder and burn the oil. Doing Valve seals on the 4.6 can be a pain. But before you do that try this first. If you are using a light oil like 5w20 or 5w30 jump up to 10w30 and use Lucas oil stabilizer. Try this for about the next 2 oil changes and see if it gets better. The Lucas should soften up the seals and help them to swell back up. If it works use Lucas on every oil change. We have on every car. Our sedan has 315,000 miles now and no blue smoke. Hope this helps good luck.
    elegant you sound like a mechanic to me kudos ....this is coming from me as a mechanic/ shop owner +1 on the lucas oil stabilizer , good product and works very well with worn motors. oil= blue smoke , fuel/rich mixture= black smoke , water/coolant leak = white smoke . as motors get old and have some miles on them they do get wear and tear, the clearances allow oil to seep through the valve guide seals and other engine parts causing smoke. nothing to panic about , follow elegants procedure and you have some good results. goodluck

  10. #10
    Senior Member Bigdan's Avatar
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    I have been a professional mechanic and I have certifications and A.S.E'S (although all expired by now) to prove it. I am a truck driver now because turning wrenches couldnt pay the bills anymore. I am trying to save enouph money to open a garage and buy decent equipment and get away from this truck for good and back to what I enjoy. A real mechanic would not diagnose by smoke color alone, those are the same guys who diagnose by trouble code. Example: get a code dealing with the egr system and then replace the egr valve only to have the code come back ending up being a break in a wire or a clogged tube. There are rare cases when blue smoke can be caused by the fuel system. Kslust has an understanding of the basic signs and was right to question the valve seals based on not smoking on startup. In my experience EVERY engine with bad seals smoked bad at startup. Most of us are aware of the seal problem with the 4.6 but it isnt always cut and dry.
    Last edited by Bigdan; June 1st, 2012 at 03:34 AM. Reason: Spelling

  11. #11
    Senior Member Elegant Limousines of Palm Coast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O5EXECL View Post
    elegant you sound like a mechanic to me kudos ....this is coming from me as a mechanic/ shop owner +1 on the lucas oil stabilizer , good product and works very well with worn motors. oil= blue smoke , fuel/rich mixture= black smoke , water/coolant leak = white smoke . as motors get old and have some miles on them they do get wear and tear, the clearances allow oil to seep through the valve guide seals and other engine parts causing smoke. nothing to panic about , follow elegants procedure and you have some good results. goodluck
    Thank you 05EXECL I'm am a tech and have been for about 15 years.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Elegant Limousines of Palm Coast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigdan View Post
    I have been a professional mechanic and I have certifications and A.S.E'S (although all expired by now) to prove it. I am a truck driver now because turning wrenches couldnt pay the bills anymore. I am trying to save enouph money to open a garage and buy decent equipment and get away from this truck for good and back to what I enjoy. A real mechanic would not diagnose by smoke color alone, those are the same guys who diagnose by trouble code. Example: get a code dealing with the egr system and then replace the egr valve only to have the code come back ending up being a break in a wire or a clogged tube. There are rare cases when blue smoke can be caused by the fuel system. Kslust has an understanding of the basic signs and was right to question the valve seals based on not smoking on startup. In my experience EVERY engine with bad seals smoked bad at startup. Most of us are aware of the seal problem with the 4.6 but it isnt always cut and dry.
    Are you hear to just argue and be a smart ass ?? because I am hear to help and don't have time for childish BS. I have been a tech since I was 16 and still make a dam good living at it. But hey opinions are like Assholes everyone has one and they all stink. Like I said I have better things to do that have a battle of whits with an unarmed man. I hope my suggestions help and that's all that matters have a nice day.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Bigdan's Avatar
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    I have been a "tech" for 13 years plus the 11 years I helped my dad with his side jobs. I could still make good money at places like Midas, as long as I leave my soul at home. I dont see how I am being a smart ass, I tried a different angle on this problem and your words "not true" and then proceeded to downtalk me like I am a child. Im just giving it right back to you and yeah I did take it as an insult. This will be my last word on this thread as I am plenty "armed" but what is the point of arguing with someone over 1,000 miles away? Good luck kslust, hope you find a solution.
    Last edited by Bigdan; June 1st, 2012 at 05:13 AM.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Party Bus Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigdan View Post
    I have been a professional mechanic and I have certifications and A.S.E'S (although all expired by now) to prove it. I am a truck driver now because turning wrenches couldnt pay the bills anymore. I am trying to save enouph money to open a garage and buy decent equipment and get away from this truck for good and back to what I enjoy. A real mechanic would not diagnose by smoke color alone, those are the same guys who diagnose by trouble code. Example: get a code dealing with the egr system and then replace the egr valve only to have the code come back ending up being a break in a wire or a clogged tube. There are rare cases when blue smoke can be caused by the fuel system. Kslust has an understanding of the basic signs and was right to question the valve seals based on not smoking on startup. In my experience EVERY engine with bad seals smoked bad at startup. Most of us are aware of the seal problem with the 4.6 but it isnt always cut and dry.
    Where would you suggest Karl start looking? Everyone else is suggesting the most common problem, valve guide seals. Common sense tells me to start there since history and reputation tells us that is most likely what the problem is.

    Also, if the problem is just starting you wont notice smoking at start up. He said he notices it when taking off after 10-15 minutes of idling which tells me they are only burning a little and the soot has to build up in the exhaust pipe for it to be noticeable on take off.
    Andy
    937-620-9120
    937-524-5899 (office)
    Dunlap Limousine, LLC
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  15. #15
    Senior Member Party Bus Andy's Avatar
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    Karl: I have had experience with this. Elegant is right, use Lucas. Switching to synthetic oil couldn't hurt either.
    Andy
    937-620-9120
    937-524-5899 (office)
    Dunlap Limousine, LLC
    http://www.dunlaplimo.com

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