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Thread: Was LCT'S Targeting Of A Limousine Operator Justified?

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    Super Moderator gunny's Avatar
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    On 16 May 2008 Tampa Bay Limo Operator & NLA Board Member Julie Herring succumbed to her fight with lung cancer. Her death prompted LCT to eulogize her on their Blog Limolicious. Of course being a blog, this eulogy invited people to leave comments. There were some posts positive and respectful and there were were 3 in particular that laid into her business dealings with them.

    Of the 3, one was "supposedly" from a limo operator with the post containing a link to his website.

    Needless to say, LCT took offense to these posts (individuals) & started another Blog "Limo Losers" posting each of the 3's e-mails (despite the log in disclaimer) & the operaters website link. LCT urged that these individuals be boycotted & so on.

    On LDC a LCT writer basically repeated the "Limo Losers" Blog on Limolicious with added comments.

    The Operator just so happens to be located in my town & I sent him a blast informing him that LCT has targeted him. He called me within minutes & informed me that he made no comments on Limolicious. He went on the LCT Blog & posted that it wasn't him & to remove him from the "Limo Loser" post as legal action will be taken. In the meantime, I came on LDC & in quoting the post inquired into if it was confirmed that this Operator did in fact make the controversial post.

    The Operator soon came on LDC & repeated his demand that references to his company be removed under threat of legal action. Soon after Limolicious edited the Blog & LDC deleted all references to this.

    This isn't about Julie Herring or the validation of accusations posted by some but of the responsibility of LCT and the actions they took over this episode. LCT blasted a limousine service with the intent to cause that Operator financial injury before even validating that it was the Operator who made a post that offended "some" individuals & if I didn't spot it & inform the Operator, who knows how long it would of been before he found out about it.

    I found this act of revenge 100% unprofessional & if LCT can't take the heat or control their emotions, they should shut that Blog down & continue with their controlled public presentation of industry affairs through written form.
    Airport Limo Service Spring Hill, Brooksville, Citrus County FL
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    Senior Member Limo Padawan InTheLeftLane's Avatar
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    Gunny,

    I'm sure you caught my post at LimoLicious on the situation as well.

    I've seen these situations come about before in one of them someone had their identity 'stolen' and a post made on their behalf that did not represent their true views and then they had to prove (somehow) that it was not them. In one situation they we're unsuccessful. They had already positioned themselves as detractors so people found it easy to belive they had posted the comment.

    Do I think that LimoLicious did the right thing by 'outing' them? Hmmm... seems not. Do I think that blog / forum comments will sometime go astray and create this kind of drama - you can bet on it.

    By an large though, I see that a community will police itself, the jerks uncovered and then life goes on.

    Not sure I've ever seen a group / industry blog sucessfully moderate a comment thread...
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    Super Moderator gunny's Avatar
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    Originally posted by InTheLeftLane:

    Do I think that LimoLicious did the right thing by 'outing' them? Hmmm... seems not. Do I think that blog / forum comments will sometime go astray and create this kind of drama - you can bet on it.

    By an large though, I see that a community will police itself, the jerks uncovered and then life goes on.
    In this case, the actions of LCT/LimoLicious was malicious.

    The community policing itself? Don't think so as no Tampa elite even came to the defense & with good reason. This is a dirty business with a lot of dirty little secrets & not all of the drivers are imbeciles and therefore, not too many are willing to open that can of worms that could put themselves on the firing line. This plus knowing what leaches that this industry is composed of, all bets are that they (the Tampa elite) are now preoccupied with a pie.
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    Senior Member Wade Randolph's Avatar
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    You know Gunny there are bad appples in every industry. Bad owners and bad employees. My stepmother is in the real estate business and it is much worse than the limousine business. That being said I find it incredulous that any ex chauffeur would wish death on this lady or somehow gleam with excitement over her suffering. I am sure those disgruntled chauffeurs were perfect in every way and never had an ounce of sin in their life. I did not know the lady but I know she was considered a beautiful child of god just like you and me. What I really noticed about the blog was the cowardice of those making the posts. Not only were they too spineless to leave their own real names but they posted with others names. I do think LCT may have jumped the gun without checking but it would be hard to not get emotional about these statements considering her relationship with the staff of LCT.

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    Super Moderator gunny's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Wade Randolph:
    You know Gunny there are bad appples in every industry. Bad owners and bad employees. My stepmother is in the real estate business and it is much worse than the limousine business. That being said I find it incredulous that any ex chauffeur would wish death on this lady or somehow gleam with excitement over her suffering. I am sure those disgruntled chauffeurs were perfect in every way and never had an ounce of sin in their life. I did not know the lady but I know she was considered a beautiful child of god just like you and me. What I really noticed about the blog was the cowardice of those making the posts. Not only were they too spineless to leave their own real names but they posted with others names. I do think LCT may have jumped the gun without checking but it would be hard to not get emotional about these statements considering her relationship with the staff of LCT.
    Yes, LCT unprofessionally jumped gun because they allowed their emotions to get the best of them & it resulted in them doing something far more worse than a couple of negative posts. I've read the comments & in fact made a copy. One comment has been verified as at least somewhat factual and known. They are just lucky others held their tongue on subject matter contained in the eulogy & as I posted before, no defense made by the Tampa crew so one would really have to wonder who is more spineless. Got news for you, any public figure who moves on is subject to the same type of ridicule by those they may have done wrong to in life & with most papers now running Blogs with the stories, such is frequent & professionals need to now how to deal with this without resulting to pulpit bullying tactics that can hurt the innocent which seems to have flown over your head Wade as the subject of this thread.
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    Senior Member Wade Randolph's Avatar
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    I know what the subject was the condemnation of LCT to attack without verifying. I got that. Since this is a blog I wanted to state my whole opinion on the subject.

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    Super Moderator Limo Scene's Avatar
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    Wade, thank you for pointing out that LCT is in fact made up of humans who have human emotions. Do we have a responsibility to act based on fact instead of emotion? Of course. But it reverts back to the fact that we are human. The decisions made both to post and to retract were made by the Editor in Chief who does not even know Julie but knows of her good work and knows that anyone who makes unsavroy comments about a recently departed person is scum anyway you look at it.

    My post was deleted by LDC which in itself was exercising their own right to censorship.

    In reality, I call the denial of the post attributed to the guy in Tampa - B.S.! He didn't realize so many people would read it and realize just what type of person he really is. Next he took steps to undo his mess.

    I call and ace and ace, a spade a spade and I see this in black and white for what it really is.
    Jim A. Luff
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    Super Moderator gunny's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Limo Scene:
    In reality, I call the denial of the post attributed to the guy in Tampa - B.S.! He didn't realize so many people would read it and realize just what type of person he really is. Next he took steps to undo his mess.
    So that settles the question of why a link to his website was included. I was wondering why someone who would make such a post would provide a direct link to his business.
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    Super Moderator Limo Scene's Avatar
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    Obviously people like that are not the sharpest knife in the drawer to begin with and perhaps he thought so many people shared his sentiments that he would be some kind of hero for his post when in reality he is clearly a zero which is close to hero only by the spelling.

    I'm just not buying it one bit and I have my reasons but I really don't wish to cause myself any legal problems. I will just say this, nothing you do on the Internet is really anonymous. Everyone has an IP address and every IP address is attributed to a CPU somewhere.

    Just like when you search for something and all the local stuff pops up on your computer because the Internet knows your IP address is in Springhill, Florida. Same concept can identify where a post came from regardless of what name they claim to be.

    The question you posed was:

    Was LCT's Targeting of a Limousine Operator Justifed?

    Answer: Absolutely!

    We reap what we sow!
    Jim A. Luff
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    Limousine Scene - An Award Winning Company Since 1990
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    Limousines, Sedans, Vans, Charter Buses, Limo-Buses, Wheelchair Vans www.limousinescene.com

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    Senior Member HeavenOnWheels's Avatar
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    My opinion, which may not matter to anyone is this. LCT, being an informational tool to limousine operators, should remain as unbiased as possible. An organization such as a newspaper, magazine or any other media outlet should not have "opinions." When that media outlet provides a option to allow people to make comments or provide their opinions on their site, then they should be ready for all types of comments, from rude, mocking or supportive comments, all be it the same.

    That being said, I am sure that there were plenty of other people who did not agree with the nasty comments made and replied themselves. LCT, again in my opinion, should never have stepped in, instead, report, inform, and allow readers to make their own opinions. I in no way agree or even understand why such comments were made and am sure 99% of readers agree.

    Just my two cents. My condolences to all who knew Julie Herring and I pray that her family can make it through these tough times.

    Originally posted by gunny:
    On 16 May 2008 Tampa Bay Limo Operator & NLA Board Member Julie Herring succumbed to her fight with lung cancer. Her death prompted LCT to eulogize her on their Blog Limolicious. Of course being a blog, this eulogy invited people to leave comments. There were some posts positive and respectful and there were were 3 in particular that laid into her business dealings with them.

    Of the 3, one was "supposedly" from a limo operator with the post containing a link to his website.

    Needless to say, LCT took offense to these posts (individuals) & started another Blog "Limo Losers" posting each of the 3's e-mails (despite the log in disclaimer) & the operaters website link. LCT urged that these individuals be boycotted & so on.

    On LDC a LCT writer basically repeated the "Limo Losers" Blog on Limolicious with added comments.

    The Operator just so happens to be located in my town & I sent him a blast informing him that LCT has targeted him. He called me within minutes & informed me that he made no comments on Limolicious. He went on the LCT Blog & posted that it wasn't him & to remove him from the "Limo Loser" post as legal action will be taken. In the meantime, I came on LDC & in quoting the post inquired into if it was confirmed that this Operator did in fact make the controversial post.

    The Operator soon came on LDC & repeated his demand that references to his company be removed under threat of legal action. Soon after Limolicious edited the Blog & LDC deleted all references to this.

    This isn't about Julie Herring or the validation of accusations posted by some but of the responsibility of LCT and the actions they took over this episode. LCT blasted a limousine service with the intent to cause that Operator financial injury before even validating that it was the Operator who made a post that offended "some" individuals & if I didn't spot it & inform the Operator, who knows how long it would of been before he found out about it.

    I found this act of revenge 100% unprofessional & if LCT can't take the heat or control their emotions, they should shut that Blog down & continue with their controlled public presentation of industry affairs through written form.

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    Senior Member Limo Padawan InTheLeftLane's Avatar
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by HeavenOnWheels:
    LCT, again in my opinion, should never have stepped in, instead, report, inform, and allow readers to make their own opinions. [QUOTE]

    Meh... it's the first year of the blog and they're cutting their teeth... sorry it had to be Ms. Herrings post that got the butt of it. It was going to happen, not if / when. Part of the human dynamic I think.
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    Super Moderator gunny's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Limo Scene:
    Obviously people like that are not the sharpest knife in the drawer to begin with and perhaps he thought so many people shared his sentiments that he would be some kind of hero for his post when in reality he is clearly a zero which is close to hero only by the spelling.

    I'm just not buying it one bit and I have my reasons but I really don't wish to cause myself any legal problems. I will just say this, nothing you do on the Internet is really anonymous. Everyone has an IP address and every IP address is attributed to a CPU somewhere.

    Just like when you search for something and all the local stuff pops up on your computer because the Internet knows your IP address is in Springhill, Florida. Same concept can identify where a post came from regardless of what name they claim to be.

    The question you posed was:

    Was LCT's Targeting of a Limousine Operator Justifed?

    Answer: Absolutely!

    We reap what we sow!
    So what you are stating is that the following message put out by LimoLicious, a Blog of a National Publication against Sunshine Limousines of Spring Hill, Florida -

    "So, in the spirit of free speech, the editors at LCT Magazine would like to label these respondents as cowardly losers."
    "If you know these limo posers, the best response is a boycott: Don't do business with them, don't hire them, and cancel any affiliate relationships"

    Because of the following post that "contained" a direct link to Sunshine Limousines & without any validation that the post was made by the owner of this business:

    "Are you kidding in this article. Nobody liked her. If she owed you money, she would start an argument with you so she didn't have to pay.

    She started the company by ripping off that guy Gary and pushing him out to clean the cars.

    The only party should be the same when the house fell on that chick in the wizard of Oz.

    What a bunch of phoneys on this page."

    Now I typed the subject post as it was actually displayed before deletion off the LCT Blog. Anthony from Sunshine has made numerous post on LDC. He was smacked around a few times for using ALL UPPER CASE LETTERS as this is his normal mode of typing & evident on his website. He made an attempt to go lower case & except the first letter of a sentence, everything stayed on the lower case mode including i's & names of persons etc.. In fact his responses that were deleted, ALL UPPER CASE LETTERING.

    So, without any validation that the offending post was made by the owner of Sunshine Limousines and the most offending portion of this post is that whoever wrote it might of been singing "Ding Dong the Witch is Dead" to themselves, Control Freak National Publication LCT decided to try and cause economic damage to this company & LCT Representative Luff calls this action justified.

    I wonder if a 1st Amendment Attorney, like my very own bud Luke Lirot would have a different opinion.

    I might as well throw down the other 2 offending posts so Wade can specifically point out "wishing death on this lady or gleam excitement over her suffering"

    "She employed 1000 drivers...and ripped 'em off all! Genius con act she pulled by deducting $10 a week to cover injuries for some bogus union?? Sheer genius. Also employed the biggest bitch and asshole DISPATCHERS the limo biz has ever seen!"

    "She always gave 110 percent .. except she would steal back the 10%. Does this mean all us drivers will get a refund from the money she stole from us???"

    Quite frankly, I've heard a hell of a lot worse back in the Funeral Driving days & being called in to Bounce at the Funeral Homes.
    Airport Limo Service Spring Hill, Brooksville, Citrus County FL
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  13. #13

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    Yeah Jim. You certainly do reap what you sow-and the world community of operators knows !
    Originally posted by Limo Scene:
    Obviously people like that are not the sharpest knife in the drawer to begin with and perhaps he thought so many people shared his sentiments that he would be some kind of hero for his post when in reality he is clearly a zero which is close to hero only by the spelling.

    I'm just not buying it one bit and I have my reasons but I really don't wish to cause myself any legal problems. I will just say this, nothing you do on the Internet is really anonymous. Everyone has an IP address and every IP address is attributed to a CPU somewhere.

    Just like when you search for something and all the local stuff pops up on your computer because the Internet knows your IP address is in Springhill, Florida. Same concept can identify where a post came from regardless of what name they claim to be.

    The question you posed was:

    Was LCT's Targeting of a Limousine Operator Justifed?

    Answer: Absolutely!

    We reap what we sow!
    Dean Schuler

  14. #14
    Senior Member Limo Padawan
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    That is nice but my ip address does not match the ip address who posted lct told me that after the damage was done to my company in other words i can type in any company name email address and website link and post crap because lct does not do there homework and check out facts i never had any dealings with julies so i have no reason to talk bad about her she is located a hour south from me My lawyer has begun legal action against lct for economic distress i will teach them to slam companies without any verification of facts!!!!!!!!



    I'm just not buying it one bit and I have my reasons but I really don't wish to cause myself any legal problems. I will just say this, nothing you do on the Internet is really anonymous. Everyone has an IP address and every IP address is attributed to a CPU somewhere.

    Just like when you search for something and all the local stuff pops up on your computer because the Internet knows your IP address is in Springhill, Florida. Same concept can identify where a post came from regardless of what name they claim to be.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Wade Randolph's Avatar
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    Originally posted by sunshinelimos:
    That is nice but my ip address does not match the ip address who posted lct told me that after the damage was done to my company in other words i can type in any company name email address and website link and post crap because lct does not do there homework and check out facts i never had any dealings with julies so i have no reason to talk bad about her she is located a hour south from me My lawyer has begun legal action against lct for economic distress i will teach them to slam companies without any verification of facts!!!!!!!!



    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I'm just not buying it one bit and I have my reasons but I really don't wish to cause myself any legal problems. I will just say this, nothing you do on the Internet is really anonymous. Everyone has an IP address and every IP address is attributed to a CPU somewhere.

    Just like when you search for something and all the local stuff pops up on your computer because the Internet knows your IP address is in Springhill, Florida. Same concept can identify where a post came from regardless of what name they claim to be.
    </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Why don't you also go after the person that used your name and your website link? If you take legal action this information could be found out.

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