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Thread: I'm going to stick with caddies

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegant Limousines of Palm Coast View Post
    I have said it before and I'll say it again Caddys are junk. This is from a techs point of view. Common problems at low mileage.
    Bolts break off in cylinder head and cause coolant leak. water pump leaks, plastic intake leaks at intake boot causing idle problem. I love this one if you need a starter it is under the intake manifold of the engine. Ya no fast starter swaps for this rolling piece of crap. At about 70k miles expect to have oil leaks that cant be fixed unless you remove the engine or transmission to re seal the 2 piece oil pan. The list goes on and on.
    The only thing I like about caddys is when I see one pull in my shop I know I am gonna make some money.
    The cylinder head bolts don't break, they pull the threads out of the block. A change to the thread pitch was made in the MY 03-04 time frame. As far as the starter issue goes, not that many starters fail anymore and if they do removing the intake is not that big of a deal. BTW you left off the oil consumption issue. It stared in '96 with a design change to the piston and rings. In '03 revised piston rings were released. This engine use's a two piece engine block (not a two piece oil pan) the seals shrink over time and they start leaking oil, yes it's a major repair. RTV is now used in place of the seals. In general the MY 03-04 is a much improved engine/car. But still not the workhorse of the TC. Steve

  2. #32
    Senior Member Cedar Mill Limousine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick E. View Post
    Actually, many of those companies are my customers. A1 does have GM certified mechanics in-house due to the size of their fleet. Many of their vehicles hit 200,000 miles before the second year of ownership.

    Rudy's is another high mileage user, most of their fleet hits 200,000 in approximatley 18 months but they go to the dealers for everything. It makes sense since they don't have a garage facility and on the 2011's oil changes, filters, etc are free for the first 50,000 miles anyway.

    London, HY's and a some of the others only do oil changes, brakes, and service in-house and use the dealer for everything else. Our shop also does the service work for Dav-EL, Boston Coach et al.

    Some of these companies keep their cars for a short period of time. Boston Coach doesn't want their clients to be in "old" cars and they rotate out of cars at 30,000 miles. Many of my clients maximize the residual value of their vehicles by selling them when they have approximatley 6 months of remaining warranty since it's easier to sell vehicles still under factory warranty. And some others like A1, Rudy's keep their cars for high mileage.

    The majority of my customers are running large fleets. They don't decide to purchase cars because they want to update. They don't decide to buy cars because they want something that looks fresher. They have purchase plans based on the advice given to them by their accountants. They buy cars based upon depreciation schedules. Once there is no tax advantage to a vehicle they flip it to a replacement vehicle that does have a tax advantage. The way the depreciation was last year, you could get back about 60% of the purchase price in the first year. Once the depreciation on a vehicle runs dry it is immediatley replaced.

    In converted product (hearses and limousines) I sell both Lincoln and Cadillac product. Please don't try telling me that the Lincoln product is 100% troublefree (1) if they were, in the back of every Lincoln dealership there would be no reason to have a Service Department. (2) Many of the posters here are quick to badmouth a Cadillac product but I see these same posters asking for help in fixing their Lincolns since they, their mechanics, and sometimes their local Lincoln dealership can't fix a particular issue quickly and easily.

    THE FUTURE: Without a doubt I will state the the Lincoln is a very reliable vehicle. It is also a very old vehicle - not just in terms of the sheetmetal; but in terms of the entire Panther platform. GM had a very similar platform, the D-body that ended production in 1996. The Cadillac Fleetwood, Buick Roadmaster, and Chevrolet Caprice were all body-on-frame vehicles with a simple drive train and LT1 Corvette engines or de-tuned 350's depending upon the year.

    This industry notwithstandng, there is NO market for full size, rear wheel drive cars. If you add municipal sales (police, fire, utility to limousine/livery) you come up with a whopping 1% of all automobile production. No manufacturer can afford to build a vehicle with (free) extended warranties, heavy incentives, and profitably build a vehicle for the market.

    Future Lincoln product is going to be NO different then current/future Cadillac product. You are no longer going to see Lincoln with an older, more reliable design. Lincoln's current and future products (like that of all manufacturers) is going to be more complex, more computer controlled, and most certainly unable to serviced by non-factory trained technicians. I know from where I talk, the pictures posted on this board of the MKT hearse is our hearse! We built it for the NFDA Show in New Orleans last fall. While I know this is anecdotal, the first MKT that I delivered (non-conversion - for a client's family SUV' spent 6 (six) weeks at the local Lincoln/Ford dealership since they couldn't figure out why the check engine light was on. I will admit that their MKT has not been back to the dealer yet this month, but six weeks is a long time to diagnose/correct something on a car with 80 miles on it.
    Good info Rick. I don't think anyone is saying that Lincoln is "troublefree", but you have to admit that there has to be a reason there are more LTCs at ORD than DTS by about 100:1. The LTCs have always been easier to maintain, cheaper to maintain, and last longer. The DTS in my opinion looks much better - but when it comes to looks vs. profit margin, money wins (I understand the bigger companies with huge fleets - it is a totally different animal, I would think than the little guy with 10 cars or less).
    Rich Rottier
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by CEC View Post
    I have a 2004 Escalade ESV that is mostly my airport car now. It has run great for the last 282,000mi. Mo major issues. The worst issue I had was a bent tie rod after hitting a pothole. The truck runs great in all weather.
    The key word here is Truck.

  4. #34
    Senior Member MrQ45Limo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Earl Metcalf View Post
    The key word here is Truck.
    I agree with Earl on this one (Key word truck)
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    Senior Member Wade Randolph's Avatar
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    Also if you are buying new and selling before the warranty expires it does not matter if you buy Cadillac or Lincoln. In the past we have always sold our units before the warranty expired. Last year was the first time in years that we kept cars for longer than 3 years.

  6. #36
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    Default Been ther done that with both.

    I have had both Lincolns and Caddies. When we retired the caddie my wife kept it as her personal car. Still driving it today. Even when it had twice the mileage of the Town Car that replaced it. It would accelerate faster, corner quicker ride smoother, more comfortable to sit in. The worst gas mileage it got was still better than the Town Cars and at 250,000 miles still had it's original water pump starter and alternator. The one time the check engine light came on cost three dollars to fix. The TC would not go two days without turning on check engine light. Even after replacing the engine the check engine light came back on. Finally got rid of the car. The caddie we take on trips. Replaced TC with Chrysler 300 C Hemi. one week in the Chrysler, and I would quit the business before I would go back to a TC. I hated that car from day one and it didn't do anything to change my opinion. I know most people swear by Lincolns I swear at them. I was so pissed off by the trouble I had with mine that I won't even buy a Ford, and I used to like them. But my experience with this one was so bad I'm not risking it again.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglecrest View Post
    I have had both Lincolns and Caddies. When we retired the caddie my wife kept it as her personal car. Still driving it today. Even when it had twice the mileage of the Town Car that replaced it. It would accelerate faster, corner quicker ride smoother, more comfortable to sit in. The worst gas mileage it got was still better than the Town Cars and at 250,000 miles still had it's original water pump starter and alternator. The one time the check engine light came on cost three dollars to fix. The TC would not go two days without turning on check engine light. Even after replacing the engine the check engine light came back on. Finally got rid of the car. The caddie we take on trips. Replaced TC with Chrysler 300 C Hemi. one week in the Chrysler, and I would quit the business before I would go back to a TC. I hated that car from day one and it didn't do anything to change my opinion. I know most people swear by Lincolns I swear at them. I was so pissed off by the trouble I had with mine that I won't even buy a Ford, and I used to like them. But my experience with this one was so bad I'm not risking it again.
    Did you buy the LTC new or used?
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  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglecrest View Post
    I have had both Lincolns and Caddies. When we retired the caddie my wife kept it as her personal car. Still driving it today. Even when it had twice the mileage of the Town Car that replaced it. It would accelerate faster, corner quicker ride smoother, more comfortable to sit in. The worst gas mileage it got was still better than the Town Cars and at 250,000 miles still had it's original water pump starter and alternator. The one time the check engine light came on cost three dollars to fix. The TC would not go two days without turning on check engine light. Even after replacing the engine the check engine light came back on. Finally got rid of the car. The caddie we take on trips. Replaced TC with Chrysler 300 C Hemi. one week in the Chrysler, and I would quit the business before I would go back to a TC. I hated that car from day one and it didn't do anything to change my opinion. I know most people swear by Lincolns I swear at them. I was so pissed off by the trouble I had with mine that I won't even buy a Ford, and I used to like them. But my experience with this one was so bad I'm not risking it again.
    Eaglecrest,
    I totally understand your frustration but surely you can't speak for all of the TC's out there based on your experience of one TC. Good to hear you've had good luck with the caddy because the company I used to work at, fleet of close to 100, a few years back had nothing but issues with the caddies and virtually nothing with the TC's except the later models experiencing faulty cooling fans and an occasional faulty coil.
    As for the caddies, I'm in the process of doing a valve job on one of my personal cars and after extensive research, I have learned that the caddies had a major design flaw causing stripped cylinder head threads in the block resulting in a blown head gasket. Consider yourself very fortunate that yours has been trouble free. I do concur with you in that the caddy handles well as the suspension is light years ahead to the TC's.
    My personal opinion is that a TC is better suited for many different types of drivers where the caddy isn't. Not a bad thing for the caddy, its just not a livery vehicle.

  9. #39
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    As much fun as this discussion has been we need to look forward to what's next. The TC is going away so what are you going to replace it with next?

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