NLA Reformed!

The new formation of the NLA Board of directors holds an enormous potential for unprecedented success. These people are committed. They all deserve our utmost respect, confidence and support. The annual NLA meeting was standing room only. We voted on the by-law revisions, the word of mouth consensus was that the changes passed, but I have not heard an official report yet.

The educational seminars that the NLA produced at the show were fantastic. I attended as many as I could. The one called 'Limo 101' was designed for the new small operator. Though I have been in the business about ten years and have a lot of volume to show for it I learned a great deal that day. There was another seminar about crisis management. Again, just when I thought I did everything right, I learned some more. Another seminar was about leadership, in that one I learned the most. But the greatest lesson I learned at the show was during a speach by the incomming NLA President, Scott Solombrino. He talked about the impending disaster we all face with regard to insurance. He's got some really good ideas. The guy is a genius. I guess he doesn't control over 13,000 cars for nothing. If you want to know what he said, JOIN THE NLA. You'll save a lot of money with this knowledge, maybe even your company.

I think the people on the NLA board care a lot more about the industry than anyone here has given them credit for. For starters they volunteer to serve us, they receive only nominal rembursemnt for their expenses, far less than the actual costs of traveling to their various NLA commitments. They spend countless hours of their time attending to issues important to the industry. The afternoon of September 11, most of us sat in our quiet offices worrying about our own companies, our former NLA President Barbara Pastelak spent that day, and countless hours in the weeks or months to follow, working for us in many ways.

It pains me to see the negitive tone to the posts here. I decided to wait until today to post in the NLA thread. I wanted to see if anyone but me would tell you about the good things the board does or the good people on it. I wanted to see if anyone would actually say somthing good about the NLA here. Nope!

There have been no posts since mine on March 4. There I asked the question; How many directors are there on the TLPA board (or somthing like that). Nobody answered. It seems that the people who do the negitive posting here and the bantering about how the board members can't get anything done(even though they get quite a lot done) because there are too many of them or about how disfunctional the by-laws are, don't want to acknowledge that there are 40 more directors on the TLPA board than on the NLA board or that there isn't really anything wrong with the by-laws that hasn't been addressed or isnt being considered. I think it is nothing less than LAUGHABLE to know that the most frequent poster of negative opinion didn't even care enough to attend the annual meeting, called it a "waste of time".

I just want to mention one more thing that happened at the show, it was the auction for the Harold Berkman Fund. It took place after the awards banquet. The Harold Berkman Fund benefits kids, in many ways. There were several items given to the NLA to be auctioned off, many from NLA Board members, with the proceeds to benefit the Berkman Fund and therefor kids in need. I was quite impressed at first that these people, who give so much of their time to the industry would give so freely when their contributions are already far in excess of the rest of us can or will do.

Then the most amazing thing happened, the same people began to buy back each others contributions. It was incredible. There were,of course, people other than NLA Board members that gave items and bought them, but the top 7 or 8 operators in the country where the ones doing the majority of the buying. I saw David Seelinger buy and give back the same item like 3 times. At one point, George Jacobs (who was playing auctioneer) offered a hundred dollar bill to any bidder that would pay more for the current item. The guy that got the bill gave it back so George auctioned off the bill. It sold for $1000. All totalled, they raised over $41,000 for kids. It was an emotionally moving experience to be in the room that night.

My point is this; these people care. They care about you, they care about me, they care about the limousine industry, they care about the NLA and they care about kids.

I care enough to say that I am proud to be a member of an association that is run by people like this. I care enough to say that you should be a member to. JOIN THE NLA TODAY !!!!!!!!!!

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ

[This message was edited by AAA/GOT on April 01, 2002 at 07:34 PM.]

[This message was edited by AAA/GOT on April 01, 2002 at 07:35 PM.]

Matt thank you for your post. I have a warm fuzzy feeling about me now. My staff and I are going to hold hands and sing Kumbaya.

Wade Randolph

I experienced all the same things that you did Matt! I loved the leadership class. It was my favorite and changes have been made and more care coming as a result of that class. They are going to be ugly to my drivers but the class gave me the courage to do it. Beginning 04/01, a driver is allowed to be late ONCE. Upon their second time of being late, there will be no discussion about why they were late. It doesn't matter. They just no longer have a job. I sent this message as soon as I got back from Vegas through the ranks and it's already working. Not a problem with late to pick up but arriving in time to do a thorough pre-trip inspection and take some pride in setting the car up. I agree with you on the negative posts. I have been quiet lately because everytime I post anything positive or contrary, I am considered a "schill" by the author of negativity. The conference provided insight on that issue as well. I learned that the author's fleet is about three cars of which he owns none. Furthermore, by this time, his membership dues check has more than likely been returned to him with a polite "no thanks" to accepting his money or his membership. I am sending my check in to the NLA today and plan to stand behind the board 100%. Now let's keep the new spin of positivity here going. As a united industry, we have power and ability.

Wade, is that you singing that I hear? I'm joining in.

The topics in these forums regarding NLA have a single thread. A number of us have pointed out, for over almost two years, all of the deficiencies, problems and failures of NLA, yet not one person has ever been able to come forward and refute those charges - indeed, they have been both privately and publicly admitted. What else is common throughout these topics is the "cheerleaders" who can muster no more argument nor intellectual prowess than to say that the critics are "negative" - not wrong, mind you, but negative. There is nothing productive in getting into a battle of wits with unarmed combatants, so I'll resist the temptation.
Insofar as attacks on our company is concerned, however, let's get Luff and his cohorts from the "conference" (whatever that was) to put their money where their mouths are. The last time this drivel came up nobody had the balls to come forward, and I'm sure eunuchs like Luff are no different. Here's the offer to you big mouths out there - ANY and ALL of you balless wonders: Send $25,000 to Michael at limos.com and make a flight reservation to Pittsburgh. You can tour our garage and we'll have vehicle titles available to you for examination. For every car in the fleet over 3, we get $5,000 of your $25,000. Since you probably don't have $25,000, get Solombrino to spot it for you on his Amex Black Car (or any of the others who raised money for the kids). Just to be clear, however, we do admit to not "owning" any of our vehicles. All of them are owned by an affiliated corporation under common ownership with our company and we lease them to ourselves, for tax reasons.
Every day that goes by without one of the "positive" people accepting this offer, I'll be sure to note it here so the industry can see what fakes these people really are. Another word for a fake is a shill.
Is anyone really so stupid in this industry to believe that Solombrino "controls" 13,000 cars? THIS is why there is no hope for NLA. As I have said before, in the land of the blind the one-eyed man is king. This is why every time the rank and file go to a show they come back applauding the gathering of cyclops.
Spare me this silliness which we have to endure once a year. Did you all enjoy the group hug in Las Vegas?
When should we expect you here, Luff? Take a "positive" step for the industry and step right up and pay the price of admission (since you claim to have nothing to lose), or admit to the industry here and now what a fool you really are - which I expect to trumpet every day.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

For information on the TLPA go to their website or call them up. You will find that they are wonderful, helpful people with a wealth of knowledge.

Dean Schuler

Wade, You have been in the limousine business over two decades. Share with the readership the days when many stated that cars could not be stretched over 50 inches for safety reasons. Or how about the time the coachbuilder rep brought a car to you with a curtain rod & a curtain for a partition !! ( partition school is an advanced course )It is good the titans of livery gave you a 'warm fuzzy feeling " at the Vegas Show. For health reasons, I'll skip any comments about the Show girls !!

Dean Schuler

At least you were intelligent enough to figure out who we were talking about. Those that spent the money to attend and benefit from the show demonstrated true committment to further their education and state of our industry. Your lack of participation shows it wasn't that important to you. If I come to see you, will you take me to the Hershey plant? I would be much more interested in visiting that facility while in PA than yours. However,I think if I am going to make an "investment", I would be much more interested in visiting Scott's operation to find out how you grow to 13,000 cars. I have always spent time with those doing better than me to learn more than those who are playing pee-wee league ball. I prefer to think of myself as semi-pro at this point and looking to go pro in this lifetime. I think I know why you really didn't show in Vegas. I think you know just how many people in this industry don't care much for you and basically are amused by your rambling verbal assaults on anything and everything. I will not get into a battle with you, although I assure you I am armed probably more sufficient than yourself. However, I will maintain my professionalism and bite my tongue to avoid any appearance of yourself. I will however suggest that you find a competent therapist specializing in anger management to find out why you must make an issue with everything causing people to dislike you. I'm sure you're a swell guy........when your sleeping. Excuse me while I rest my case and allow you to go back to sleep.

Luff. We are in the pee wee league when it comes to white stretches hauling around drunks, because we have no interest in the retail business in which you are admittedly a semi-pro. We'll take you on any day in corporate business (and I don't mean taking ma and pa kettle to the airport) and you might learn how from dead stop to less than two years later we captured a goodly chunk of that professional and Fortune 500 market.

Having been a trial lawyer for the better part of 30 years, let me assure you that my life is not governed by an imagined popularity contest. I tend to call a spade a spade and am willing to say when the Emperor wears no clothes. The greatest part of this industry can't see clearly enough to know when the Emperor is naked. You're like all the rest - can't take the issues raised and refute them, just call names and try to discredit. Doesn't change the fact, Jimmy-boy, that NLA is still what it is, even if you join (and especially if you join).

Here's an unsolicited tip, Luff - if you really want to make it to the pros, you need to get out of Bakersfield.

To get back to my last post, I guess the implication of your response is that either you don't have the $25K, or you don't want to risk it for the good of industry to expose the author of negativity.

Geez, what happened in Las Vegas - Solombrino must haved said "hello" to you, and you wagged your butt and peed down your leg, or something.

Hey, you don't have to come to Hershey - we'll be happy to send you a box of Hershey squirts.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

I guess since you didn't attend the Atlantic City show in November that you had no interest in the educational value of the seminars or supporting the industry - or perhaps you just shill for LCT and not Digest. Strange, I made two shows last year, and one show this year - what's your score over a two year period? Hmmmmm?

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Who in Las Vegas wound up these lambs and sent them to the slaughter?

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

To those NLA directors who lurk around these forums to see what's going on and never post here (yes, you know who you are), we know that you tell everyone to ignore what is said on limos.com because nobody is here except a few disgruntled members (I think Cory Rozen set that refrain to music - before he departed the board). In that regard, I'd like to point out that this subject has 10 posts and as of this post there have been 109 views. That's a ratio of 10 readers/lurkers to 1 post. I also point out that NLA membership has so dwindled that 109 viewers is 10% of NLA membership - and this topic is only a few days old.
By comparison, look at the prior topic "NLA Reform" and note that as of this post there were about 98 posts and 1753 views, or a ratio of over 17 viewer/lurkers to one post. Need I point out that 1758 viewer/lurkers substantially exceeds NLA membership in toto.
In other words, folks, more people view these NLA topics than receive and read the LimoScene (and I don't mean Luff) which is served up in your mailbox several times per year too often.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

I do not have $25,000 laying around to come and visit the Hershey plant. I don't really care for Hershey squirts but I do like the kisses if you want to send some of those my way. That would be the candy of course. I didn't attend the Digest Show this year. I have never missed an LCT Show. It's part of my shill contract to appear at them. I have never, ever had a conversation or been personally introduced to Mr. Solombrino. I am so busted on all counts. I plead guilty counselor. I've said it in the past and I will say it again - I guess the only thing we can agree on Jimbo is to disagree. I'm okay with it. Opinions are a lot like assholes. Everyone has one. Some people are one. At least people like us have the ability to vocalize what we believe in and stand up to it even in the face of adversaries. You really should go back to practicing law. As much as I hate to say it, if I needed a good attorney, I concede you would be the best of the best. Truce time.

i think the NLA is just so the big boy limo companies can swing aroud there you know whats, talkin about who is bigger and better... personally, i know, the company that i belong to is bigger than a few of the "so called" big boys... but no one knows that, and it the owners of me company like it that way.
thats just my two cents

that you never met Solombrino and you're still having these orgasms? Truce accepted.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limo Scene:
I have never, ever had a conversation or been personally introduced to Mr. Solombrino.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

In the NLA Reform thread indeed there have been 81 posts. 32 of them from JHJ(40%). In this thread 14 posts, 6 from JHJ(42%). It seems that JHJ is the only one who insists on contiuing to do anything possible to defame the NLA.

Deficiencies, problems and failures? Would that be the by-laws, that the Board has fixed, or tried to fix? Would it be the certification program that Casteel threw at them and they did the only sensable thing they could with? Or maybe that you think there are too many people on the board, when the only other national trade organization available to us has them out numbered by 40? Jim, I can't see why you continue to make generic statements like this without stateing what you really mean. Sometimes I think you want new readers to scroll back and read two years worth of your negitive dribble. I took the time to do so while I was home sick for over a week. I began to post in the NLA thread in order to draw you out, and demonstrate that your only purpose here seems to be to prevent positive any impact from occurring. Then it got real quiet two weeks before the show, and stayed that way for two weeks after. Sometimes I think you sensed my intention and put away the computer you do so love to hide behind for fear of being exposed as the only reason nothing good can happen here.

I can tell you exactly why we don't hear from anyone on the board here, because of you. Because anything that might be said to renforce the NLA's position or reasoning on any issue would lead to countless derogatory posts by you. What successful person in the limousine industry would sign on to spend hours defending themselves against the amount of dribble you aparently have the time to generate. I am confident enough about myself, my operation and the opinion of those who know me, to know that the only derogatory effect that engaging you will have on me is the public knowledge that I actually took the time to do so. Most operators of my size and experience wouldn't give you the stage time.

Cheerleader for the NLA? You bet your ass I am. I would rather follow a one eyed man with vision, then a man with 20/20 sight and no ability to see.

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ

Hey Matt lets talk in facts and results here not personal attacks and inuendos. The NLA was founded over 16 years ago for two reasons. 1. To eliminate the gas guzzler tax. 2. To get the members a national insurance deal. Matt, which have been accomplished??? None. Tom Mazza and some of the new board members said they can turn things around at the NLA. Guess what? I am for it, and I hope they can. I am taking a wait and see attitude and have renewed my membership hoping for the best. Matt lets be realistic the NLA hasnt offered its members any real benefits since its inception. Most of the past board members and directors have used the NLA for marketing their own limo services to their clients and some have had the NLA foot their legal bills during IRS Independent Contractor issues. Being a NLA board member has ment being in the Good Ole Boys Limo Club in the past. Lets hope this is a thing of the past. Matt the NLA is OUR association and WE as paying members have the right to know certain information. This critical information has been withheld from the members. Call the NLA and ask why the financial statements havent been posted on the website in two years. Ask them if they will send you their current financial statement and see what they say. Matt I dont take any of this personal and dont see why you should. We have a right to know where OUR money is going and we have a right to see that the money is spent properly and we see some real benefits instead of empty promises.

Wade Randolph

Well said Wade. The only difference here is, Limos.com did not renew their NLA membership and are also taking the "wait-and-see" approach. We let it expire about 2 years ago.

I think (aside from all of the attacks and mudslinging) the fundamental thing to ask is "What value or benefit does the NLA offer limousine services or those involved in the limo industry?"

Based on the posts below, no one has really specified "the value" except for some really good training seminars.

When we see the "value" that is when we will join. Yes, its the old "whats in it for me?"

For example, the payment and dispute resolutions between fellow NLA members spearheaded by John Sinibaldi -- that is a great value of the NLA which perhaps could get us to join. Its a real, tangible benefit.

As for now, we are taking the wait and see approach to see if the new management does indeed bring about change.

Michael
Limos.com

http://www.limousinesonline.com/proudmember.gif

Thanks for putting me back into perspective. I think they will turn it around, We've got the best board we've had in years. I assume you heard what Scott had to say at the meeting about the insurance issues. That was the first time I heard anything on the subject that made sense. A national insurance plan just isn't possable, 16 years of having it not happen should be enough proof.

The gas guzzler isn't a huge issue for me, stretches are only 10% of my fleet, though I do support efforts to eliminate it. It's an issue that is important to the industry.

The attack may have been too personal, I'll give you that. I don't look forward to the response. I just can't stand it. It seems like every time someone tries to point a subject in a positive direction, it's automaticly snuffed. That has to stop.

Why can't we all play nice? Maybe something good will come out of it. I enjoy a good debate, that's what this is all about

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ

no response. I regarded your post as just sturm und drang.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Guy's I know everybody's tired of negatism on the forum, but we shouldn't stop giving our opinions. I have lived by being suspect of certain situations and have been very critical of the NLA and have agreed and disagreed with Jim. I thought the Vegas show was pretty decent but I also didn't expect much, that's why I was so surprised. There was more people there than I thought would be and as far as the membership meeting, when you go from nothing to something that has to be a plus. Just a guess but with more than 1 person from each company present I think 175 voting members might be close, I didn't expect more then 50. Jims correct it wasn't quit held like an actual meeting but I was so stunned at the turnout I didn't pay attention to the proper running of it. The thing about it was people have been so down about the state of the country and how bad business has been for them it was nice to see them smile about anything. Do I still have issues with the NLA, as Rocky would say absolutely, that is one reason I accepted a committee spot to review and redo the bylaws. I'll gamble with 8 months to see what happens. If the smoke blowing does not at least die down I will also call the spade a spade, in the meantime one of the best and honest people will no longer be part of the NLA and thats Carolyn Nelson. I do have an issue with something that occured with her in Vegas but it is a story for another day, believe me I will let it be known when the time is right and I have all the facts.For now gang speak your mind here and don't fight about silly sh*t, fight for what you believe is right.
TT

At the end of this month (20 days by my count) it will be the end of the first quarter of Bobit's management of NLA. So far there has been a putative annual meeting (which Guy says wasn't conducted as a meeting and as to which we don't know if there was even a quorum, or, if so, how it was counted, and no minutes or report of what, if any, formal membership action was taken) and nothing else. NLA sure was able to fax blast us, e-mail us and snail mail us several times a week before February 1, and a few such after February 1, but NLA has fallen silent. Anyone want to venture a guess how long it takes to fax blast us with a report of the annual meeting? I'd say about an hour to draft the report and a half second to push the button. Is this the reformed NLA - or is this silence merely the death watch?
Matt and Jim Luff - you seem to be in tight with the good-folks-at-NLA-who-are-giving-of-their-time-and-money - can you get us some information and a financial statement?
Maybe they're spending all their time sitting around trying to figure out if they can legally send our 2002 dues back as Luff suggested (they can't - don't waste time on this subject).

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

I will see what I can do to get the financial statement. However, I only joined the NLA last week. However, I do have a working relationship with Tom Mazza and I would not think it would be a problem as a member to ask to see the financial statement of the association. Tom, can you e-mail me about this subject. (I know JHJ, Tom is a "lurker" as you say and he will see this post).
As for the other issue, it was my understanding that YOUR check (JHJ) had or was in the process of being sent back to you with a polite, "thanks, but no thanks." I don't know what the legalities are of this. It would seem to me that a private organization could banish anyone they wanted to from joining. Just like the boys scouts don't allow homosexuals. I have not seen the bylaws so I don't know if they speak to this or not. Since I am not an attorney, I probably couldn't read the bylaws and understand them if I cared to review them (which I don't). Before I call Tom, I would like very much for you to give me a list of EXACTLY what you want and I will do my best to obtain everything in it's entirety. Will you give me the opportunity to do this and a few days of patience?

of persons with bad motives when you are not only ignorant of the by-laws, but disinterested as well. The by-laws specify the circumstances under which a member can be expelled, but, as you say, you wouldn't understand them even if you were interested enough to read them. Repeating what Mazza may say about numbers of vehicles can also only get you into trouble and make you look like a fool as it has long since been proven that Mazza can't count cars.

The list of things we want from NLA is long, but for now try the following: (1) minutes of the so-called annual meeting of the members in Las Vegas in March, 2002; (2) the annual financial statements for the years ending December 31, 2000 and December 31, 2001.

We will be necessarily patient because the likelihood that you will get anything from NLA is slim or none. You are about to get your first lesson in the malevolence of the good-people-who-give-freely-of-their-time-and-money-to-help-you-and-me-and-the-kids. Learn it well, young Jedi. This lesson is called "If we don't personally make money from it, NLA won't do it." If you learn this lesson, someday it will lead to your own American Express Black Card, which matches the color of the NLA directors' hearts.

Has Joey Cirruzzo sold out yet?


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limo Scene:
I will see what I can do to get the financial statement. However, I only joined the NLA last week. However, I do have a working relationship with Tom Mazza and I would not think it would be a problem as a member to ask to see the financial statement of the association. Tom, can you e-mail me about this subject. (I know JHJ, Tom is a "lurker" as you say and he will see this post).
As for the other issue, it was my understanding that YOUR check (JHJ) had or was in the process of being sent back to you with a polite, "thanks, but no thanks." I don't know what the legalities are of this. It would seem to me that a private organization could banish anyone they wanted to from joining. Just like the boys scouts don't allow homosexuals. I have not seen the bylaws so I don't know if they speak to this or not. Since I am not an attorney, I probably couldn't read the bylaws and understand them if I cared to review them (which I don't). Before I call Tom, I would like very much for you to give me a list of EXACTLY what you want and I will do my best to obtain everything in it's entirety. Will you give me the opportunity to do this and a few days of patience?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

somewhere along the way. Where did that come from? Is Tommy giving car counts about someone, anyone, the industry, the number represented by NLA? I am really doing to make an effort to obtain the answers to the questions but I need clarification on what car count has to do with anything as I don't recall communicating any car counts that Tom gave me on anything.

The NLA is in a transition period and will have both the minutes of the meeting and the financial statements available online by June. However, the minutes of the meeting are being faxed to me today and I will fax them to anyone interested in receiving the minutes upon request.

412.661.4023

Since the first missing financial statement is for the year ending 12/31/2000, it seems NLA has been in a "transition period" for well over a year. I'll give odds on the June target date. Any takers?


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limo Scene:
The NLA is in a transition period and will have both the minutes of the meeting and the financial statements available online by June. However, the minutes of the meeting are being faxed to me today and I will fax them to anyone interested in receiving the minutes upon request.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

JHJ, you now should be in possession of the minutes of the meeting in Vegas which I faxed to your office late this afternoon. As for financial statements that should have been compiled by the prior management company, what can I say? I guess that's why we have a new management company so that things will get done RIGHT from NOW ON. I don't think 50 days more is unreasonable to compile an accurate statement from most likely inaccurate records. I told you I would do my best and I came through on one out of two requests within 48 hours. Since Tom said the financials would be on the web by JUNE, I will take your offer, wager a friendly $20 if NOT POSTED OR MADE AVAILABLE by July 1. If I lose, I will send you a crisp one in the mail! Don't let me down Tommy!!!

I'm posting here on a laptop on a wireless connection, so I'm not in my office and haven't seen the minutes. As far as the financials are concerned, the directors get a financial every meeting. So the thought that in some way it will take 50 days to get them together is incorrect - they are held back because they are not wanted to see the light of day with the membership.

Tick . . .tick . . .tick . . .tick.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limo Scene:
JHJ, you now should be in possession of the minutes of the meeting in Vegas which I faxed to your office late this afternoon. As for financial statements that should have been compiled by the prior management company, what can I say? I guess that's why we have a new management company so that things will get done RIGHT from NOW ON. I don't think 50 days more is unreasonable to compile an accurate statement from most likely inaccurate records. I told you I would do my best and I came through on one out of two requests within 48 hours. Since Tom said the financials would be on the web by JUNE, I will take your offer, wager a friendly $20 if NOT POSTED OR MADE AVAILABLE by July 1. If I lose, I will send you a crisp one in the mail! Don't let me down Tommy!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

As an insider of the NLA something was just brought to my attention. It seems like things are smoking again down in Florida and would like to hear from some of those guys about whats going on. In checking out a website called the florida livery association I scanned their news articles, I was quite surprised about the misinformation on there.One of the things mentioned was our bylaw changes, it states that having to be a non profit organization was removed. To the members out there, this is totally false and if the writer of this article checked facts before writing he would have found out it was sent out in error and corrected on the ballots and discussed in Vegas. The article also states something to the effect of being the only statewide association, seems like I recall another organization called the FSGTO which according to a Limo Digest article just changed their named to the FGTA. I hope some of the Florida people come on to let us know whats happening. Maybe this subject should be moved to the other association forum after people know its out there.

Once before I said that the problem with NLA corporate government is that the industry is of such low quality that no one has ever served on a board of directors and, so, the board doesn't really know what a board of directors is supposed to do or how to run a corporation. That observation is still accurate.

Lest someone thinks that Jim Luff faxed me something that was responsive to the items identified a few posts ago, banish the thought. I received by fax from Jim a two page document entitled "Board of Directors Action Minutes" with a second line that says "Tuesday, April 9, 2002." Here are my comments on this document.

First, the document does not purport to be, nor is it, minutes of the annual meeting of members in Las Vegas, in the least. Thus, so far Jim Luff has been totally unsuccessful in using his "working relationship" with Mazza to get anything meaningful at all.

Second, if we assume for even a few seconds (and no matter how irrationally) that the document is any kind of minutes, then it appears to be minutes of a meeting of the board of directors on April 9, 2002. Since no one at NLA knows what minutes are, here's what such minutes should include, but do not.
Since April 9 is not a date for a regular or annual meeting of the board, it must have been a special meeting. Any minutes should specifically state that the meeting is a special meeting, how it was called, where it was held, who attended and whether there was a quorum or not. None of that appears. Minutes state who presided, and who took the minutes, but these don't. Minutes are discursive, i.e., they are a narrative of what was discussed, who said what, who made any motions, who seconded them, and what was passed upon or enacted. This document says none of that. What this document is is nothing more than a checklist of items (possibly complete, possibly not) that some group of unidentified people prepared of things for various people to do. To call this document "minutes" of anything confirms my earlier observation that these are a bunch of little kids playing "corporation."
So much for Sara's assurances here a couple of months ago that we can be assured that things will be done properly under the Bobit regime. In short, no change from prior procedure of ignoring the by-laws and the proper corporate procedures.

Third, one of the more interesting things about these so-called "minutes" is that in two pages, single-spaced, containing 37 "action" items, there is no evidence whatsoever of any item of member services or benefits of any kind.

Fourth, NLA members will be really happy to hear that this board is attempting to revive the disgraced and "tabled" certification program - in other words, another attempt to give some NLA members a tool to beat other NLA members over the head with. The more things change the more they stay the same.

Fifth, I thought Solombrino had been elected NLA president in Las Vegas, but I was apparently wrong - he is referred to as something called the "Board President" in these "minutes." In thirty-four years of practicing corporate law, I've never heard of a "Board President." Does anyone know if NLA has a president? Does the board know? Probably not.

I think the basic problem, as noted above, is that to expect NLA to organize and run itself as a REAL corporation is no different than trying to make a jackass into a thoroughbred race horse. Some things are simply genetically and biologically impossible.

One of the more interesting things about this document is that Jim asked to be specific about what I was asking for (I was), that Mazza and other directors lurk here and obviously were aware of that specific identification of the minutes requested, that presumably Jim Luff communicated that exact specification, and that he got back a piece of crap, and passed it on as something that I had identifed. All of this bungling, knowing full well that if they f**ked it up that I would tear the NLA board and staff a new a**hole in public in these forums. These people are simply too stupid to be helped.

Jim Luff, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you asked someone (presumably Mazza) for the minutes of the annual meeting of members in Las Vegas and got back a fax that you were so damn excited over getting (getting anything at all from NLA upon request is cause for excitement) that you promptly stuck it in your fax and sent it to me without giving it so much as a glance. If you did look at it, shame on you, too.

Finally, there is no mistake that NLA considers this document "minutes" because the footer identifies the source of the document as coming from the following computer drive and path: N:\NLA\Board of Directors\Minutes\April 9, 2002 action minutes.doc

No wonder the people who run NLA (whoever they are) don't want me around - they want the members to think they wear clothes. Jim and Matt probably think it is "negative" to point out that NLA has no clue how to run a corporation. Consider this - is it negative or realistic to suggest that it is IMPOSSIBLE to put pig guts in a meat grinder and get a filet mignon out the other end. Wade and others who are "waiting to see" are wasting their time (but being polite). But rest assured that I'll be here in late Fall to say "I told you so" (not nearly so politely).


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limo Scene:
JHJ, you now should be in possession of the minutes of the meeting in Vegas which I faxed to your office late this afternoon. As for financial statements that should have been compiled by the prior management company, what can I say? I guess that's why we have a new management company so that things will get done RIGHT from NOW ON. I don't think 50 days more is unreasonable to compile an accurate statement from most likely inaccurate records. I told you I would do my best and I came through on one out of two requests within 48 hours. Since Tom said the financials would be on the web by JUNE, I will take your offer, wager a friendly $20 if NOT POSTED OR MADE AVAILABLE by July 1. If I lose, I will send you a crisp one in the mail! Don't let me down Tommy!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

[This message was edited by JHJ on April 12, 2002 at 07:13 AM.]

Has Joey Cirruzzo, who ran for the board so full of piss and vinegar, given up already? Remember, Joey, that I was the guy who told you that you can't piss up a rope. Ooooooppppps - that's being negative. Matt and Jim want to think that you really can piss up a rope.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Okay Jim, I will confess that I made the request for the information. I had late afternoon meetings but in my zest to get the info to you ASAP, I gave your fax number to my secretary and told her as soon as anything from the NLA arrived by fax to turn it right back around and fax it to you. She did tell me by cell phone it had arrived and been faxed to you. I then sent made my post from home. It is still on my desk and I am still at home this morning so I will review it when I get to my office. However, I really expected that anything I sent to you or obtained for you would be ostrasized and you would manage to find negativity in. I would say you might find fault in and Andersen prepared financial statement but that's probably not a good statement these days. I will continue to provide you with anything I can to assist you in your continued bashing of NLA. Instead of spending all this energy on the bashing, could you pickup the phone, call Tom, ask him for the raw data from the meeting or even better a tape of the meeting (which I believe exists) and volunteer your time to prepare the minutes of the meeting in the proper way that you expect it to be done.
That's a thought. I wish everyone a happy Friday and a wonderful prosperous weekend. By the way......you can't piss UP a rope? I'll be damned.

to avoid the temptation to say, Jim Luff, that you guys are all wet, but I will (avoid the temptation, that is).

Come on, now, surely you didn't think at this point that I wanted minutes from the annual meeting for midnight reading did you. The issue here is simple - you contend that there's a NEW NLA, and I contend that not only has nothing change, but that the staus quo has been and is so bad that no NLA is better than what we have. Sara said that everythign would be done by the book, and tried to excuse the notice of the annual meeting, the lack of the business to be transdacted, the lack of a quorum, and the apparent lack of any minutes of the meeting, by the fact that Bobit was the "new kid" on the block. Although I wasn't buying any of that and said so, it gave everybody an opportunity to shove down my throat the NEW NLA by, in fact, doing things right.

So what did you expect after you asked me specifically what I wanted (apparently because you believed that YOU could get what no one has ever been able to), I told you, and NLA responded in its traditional, inept fashion with the wrong thing, and, moeover, a wrong thing that is an awful and atrocious example of corporate record-keeping. I'm not shooting the messenger, but let's not try feeding this "negativity" crap to the readers here because they weren't buying that spiel anyhow, and you will only end up being embarassed by NLA when you hitch your wagon to their horse.

I don't need Arthur Andersen to fuel criticism of the awful NLA financial statements. If you can read one, download the one that's posted for 1999 and you'll see that it specifically states that it is not prepared in accordance with generally accepted accounting principals in respect to the way NLA accounts for revenues and expenses - duh! In other words, even the accountant WHO DID AN AUDIT won't vouch for the financial condition of NLA.

We'll wait and see if ever NLA produces minutes of the annual meeting. Obviously, as of now they haven't.


QUOTE]Originally posted by Limo Scene:
Okay Jim, I will confess that I made the request for the information. I had late afternoon meetings but in my zest to get the info to you ASAP, I gave your fax number to my secretary and told her as soon as anything from the NLA arrived by fax to turn it right back around and fax it to you. She did tell me by cell phone it had arrived and been faxed to you. I then sent made my post from home. It is still on my desk and I am still at home this morning so I will review it when I get to my office. However, I really expected that anything I sent to you or obtained for you would be ostrasized and you would manage to find negativity in. I would say you might find fault in and Andersen prepared financial statement but that's probably not a good statement these days. I will continue to provide you with anything I can to assist you in your continued bashing of NLA. Instead of spending all this energy on the bashing, could you pickup the phone, call Tom, ask him for the raw data from the meeting or even better a tape of the meeting (which I believe exists) and volunteer your time to prepare the minutes of the meeting in the proper way that you expect it to be done.
That's a thought. I wish everyone a happy Friday and a wonderful prosperous weekend. By the way......you can't piss UP a rope? I'll be damned.[/QUOTE]

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Very interesting comments, even though I have very rarely seen any organization follow bylaws exactly it looks like this is excessive. I joined the TLPA in Vegas after watching them for the last six months. Very organized group, why dont they discuss a merger. Why does the NLA need a management company? Why does the TLPA not use a management company?

Do I hear an echo in this forum?


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jersey Joe Walcott:
Very interesting comments, even though I have very rarely seen any organization follow bylaws exactly it looks like this is excessive. I joined the TLPA in Vegas after watching them for the last six months. Very organized group, why dont they discuss a merger. Why does the NLA need a management company? Why does the TLPA not use a management company?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

First Joe C said he is there and he feels no different. He still is Joe and said John S will be putting everything on ASAP. He also said you can't fix 4 years worth of F**k ups in 4 months.
Joe WILL NOT leave the TLPA Board!
To Jersey Joe good move to join the TLPA, I to am not crazy about the idea of a management company and why but if the NLA insists on having one I think Tom Mazza is a very good choice. We have a management company for our homeowners association to, I don't know why.
Now to answer a qustion that Mr Nightmare presented you have to go to the other association forum.
TT

you lose your $20, Luff. http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

With reference to the same post, note that neither you nor I ever got the minutes. Eventually you'll become a realist.

I also want to point out that when this post occurred the 50 days was really to June 1, not July 1, so Luff padded the time with an extra 30 days - but will still lose his $20.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limo Scene:
JHJ, you now should be in possession of the minutes of the meeting in Vegas which I faxed to your office late this afternoon. As for financial statements that should have been compiled by the prior management company, what can I say? I guess that's why we have a new management company so that things will get done RIGHT from NOW ON. I don't think 50 days more is unreasonable to compile an accurate statement from most likely inaccurate records. I told you I would do my best and I came through on one out of two requests within 48 hours. Since Tom said the financials would be on the web by JUNE, I will take your offer, wager a friendly $20 if NOT POSTED OR MADE AVAILABLE by July 1. If I lose, I will send you a crisp one in the mail! Don't let me down Tommy!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

You know I spoke to Tom a couple of months ago about why the financials werent posted on the NLA website. He told me it was because in the transition with Host and Bobit that they didnt yet have control of the website which sounded reasonable, but I noticed today they seem to have updated it but still no financials posted online yet.

Wade Randolph

I may be out $20 bucks. I never intended to pad anything. If I said anything that seemed to stretch it, it was not intentional and I have no time to go back through this thread and find it. However, I am a man of my word and that means that tomorrow will mark the end of the "window of opportunity" for Tom to have the financials posted. Unfortunately, I will be leaving town tomorrow and will not return until Thursday. At that point, I will check the site and if Tommy lets me down, I will call you, get your address and send a crisp $20 bill to you so you can have a nice lunch on me. And Jim, I don't want to become a realist. I want to remain an optomist and I want you to stop being a pessimist.

Since when is telling the truth being a pessimist???

Wade Randolph

It was not specific to the particular subject of posting financials. There are those in this world that are always negative about something, those that are too positive about everything and those that just don't give a damn about anything.
Wouldn't the world be dull without all three types.

On May 16 I got an e-mail from Tom Mazza (this one came a few days before the one where this industry exemplar tells me I am a certifiable loser with no accomplishments - true, I can't make pizza) where he was disputing my predictions about the HMS NLA (read "Titanic") and ballyhooed that NLA was up 100 in membership since February 1. I responded and told him that since no one has access to any NLA records, why not think big and claim 1,000 new members, like his count of Pittsburgh Limousine vehicles. But I'm finally getting around to understanding Tom's counting problem. At first I thought maybe he was dyslexic, but I found no pattern to the sequence of numbers that would result in the numerical errors he supports. Then I thought perhaps he was simply prevaricating, but I knew that Tom would never do that - not Tom. But today I figured it out! Tom has double-vision and counts everything twice! That accounts for the Pittsburgh Limousine car count, as well as his claim for NLA membership. Today the LimoScene came!!! Surprise, surprise - more about that later. As we all know, EVERY membership application must be published in the LimoScene before it can be accepted. Well - count 'em. Forty-nine new applications! Funny about double-vision - there's a formula to it - round up to the nearest 10, then double the rounded number.
Wonder how many old members didn't renew in the same 4-month period because they didn't get any value for their memberships? Does anybody know how much it costs to get a new customer versus keeping an old one? Same thing probably applies to NLA members.
Speaking of NLA memberships - does anybody remember the good old days when NLA was flush and issued a new membership certificate every year? Looks like we're all frozen in time at year 2001 memberships - just like NLA.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

about NLA memberships.

Although NLA always gets a "bubble" of new members every year at the Las Vegas Show so that the first LimoScene after the show has a higher than usual list of new members, if we use 49 members in 4 months as a level standard (which it is not), then the average annual membership for the 12 months which will end on January 31, 2003 will be 147 (no rounding, no doubling). No telling what the NET gain or (loss) of members is for the same periods.

But here's an interesting thing to think about. Tom and LCT claim 10,000 limousine companies in the U.S. (certainly more if foreign countries are included, and NLA has foreign members). Dean Schuler claims more on the order of 20,000. Being conservative and using the 10,000, then NLA market penetration is only 10% of the industry, and it projects to grow by 1.47% of the industry (without giving effect to members who don't renew - this may REALLY be a negative net loss of members, but without breaking into the information Fort Knox that is NLA, there's no way to tell) in 2002. Half that if Dean Schuler is right.

In the same LimoScene that came today, El Presidente Scott Solombrino says that "[o]ur biggest challenge right now is to increase the membership base." I differ. The biggest challenge is for NLA to figure out what purpose it serves and what value it can and should deliver to members. Provide a product for which there is demand and sales will take care of themselves - for God's sake, NLA is a duopoly so competition is not a factor. Scott Solombrino didn't build a company by gathering customers and then trying to figure out what to sell them. Shame, Scotty.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

The "Executive Director's Report" in the new LimoScene doesn't blow a horn about the 100 new members since February 1. I wonder why not - after all, that's an important figure. Especially compared to my non-accomplishments in life.

Same report announces that the "mission" of NLA is "training and education" (even though the description of the NLA "purpose" in the by-laws mentions neither) and that T&E is being brought to "as many member companies as possible." Read this as more "road shows" to try to get more members to get more member to get more members to get more members, etc. ad infinitum.

Maybe this "mission" is best understood in the rest of the Executive Director's Report where he says "I was the facilitator . . .," "I am in Buffalo . . .," "I visit Los Angeles . . .," I am in the Hartford area . . .," "I visit the Nassau-Suffolk Limousine Association . . .," and "I will be with the LANJ . . .." Signed Tom "I" Mazza.

Does anybody at NLA understand that education and training is not Tom "I" Mazza riding circuit to sell memberships?

And why does the photograph of Thomas "I" Mazza on page 5 not look like the Thomas "I" Mazza in the photograph on the cover? Will the real Thomas "I" Mazza please stand up, please stand up (with apologies to Eminem).

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

it must be hard to breath in Pittsburg today after our resident blow-hard dispensed this amount of oral flatulence.

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ

You're just hoping that they're going to come and count your fleet someday. Did you know that just before the Titanic sailed a number of crewman signed on and a few passengers switched from other sailings to the Titanic? What luck, eh? Reminds me that I saw Luff's company name in the list of wannabees.

It always amazes me what a tough time people have with the truth. Reminds me of the old saw, "My mind is made up, don't confuse me with facts."

As for oral flatulence, at least you heard the roar!


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAA/GOT:
it must be hard to breath in Pittsburg today after our resident blow-hard dispensed this amount of oral flatulence.

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

and didn't you read about the tremendous wind damage and loss of life in Pittsburgh on Friday evening? Amazing what wind can do, isn't it?


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAA/GOT:
it must be hard to breath in Pittsburg today after our resident blow-hard dispensed this amount of oral flatulence.

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JHJ:
You're just hoping that they're going to come and count your fleet someday. Did you know that just before the Titanic sailed a number of crewman signed on and a few passengers switched from other sailings to the Titanic? What luck, eh? Reminds me that I saw Luff's company name in the list of wannabees.

It always amazes me what a tough time people have with the truth. Reminds me of the old saw, "My mind is made up, don't confuse me with facts."

As for oral flatulence, at least you heard the roar!


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAA/GOT:
it must be hard to breath in PittsburgH today after our resident blow-hard dispensed this amount of oral flatulence.

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
_Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars_
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Here's a fact you can't dispute - Tom Mazza remains the best guy for the job. Did I hear you say you wanted to-give-all-your-hard-earned-time-and-money, and run for the board next year? Or do we still have to listen to you continue to whine, like my 3 year old, here on the Forum?

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ

to your assertion and questions.

There was a time when I believed that Tom could be good for the NLA. That time was when Darryl Norman was the president, the board was populated with people who had no clue about anything, and the management contract was expiring and NLA had a chance to do some intelligent things. But NLA didn't, some other people got on the board who had a clue but also had an agenda other than turning the NLA into a functioning and VIABLE national trade association, and I learned more about Thomas "I" Mazza.

Mazza has had enough experience in the industry to make a contribution to turning NLA into something viable, but two factors prevent him from doing so. First, he has no experience building trade association programs and, therefore, has done nothing to attempt to do so but, instead, has reverted to what he has always done - go out and press flesh. He needs to be in his office working - there's more than enough to do, but the grunt work of developing NLA programs is not in his repertoire. Second, Mazza is on too much of an ego trip, can't take criticism of any kind, and plays favorites - in other words, more of the same old same old. Mazza has been appointed to the position of a trade association executive. I know trade association executives, and Thomas "I" Mazza is not a trade association executive. I believe there was a time when he could have grown into such a role, but he has turned his back on that opportunity. So what you claim is undisputable, is very debatable. Eventually the jury will come in on this whole Bobit-Mazza experiment.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAA/GOT:

Here's a fact you can't dispute - Tom Mazza remains the best guy for the job. Did I hear you say you wanted to-give-all-your-hard-earned-time-and-money, and run for the board next year? Or do we still have to listen to you continue to whine, like my 3 year old, here on the Forum?

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limouisne, Clinton NJ
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JHJ:
to your assertion and questions.

There was a time when I believed that Tom could be good for the NLA. That time was when Darryl Norman was the president, the board was populated with people who had no clue about anything, and the management contract was expiring and NLA had a chance to do some intelligent things. But NLA didn't, some other people got on the board who had a clue but also had an agenda other than turning the NLA into a functioning and VIABLE national trade association, and I learned more about Thomas "I" Mazza.

Mazza has had enough experience in the industry to make a contribution to turning NLA into something viable, but two factors prevent him from doing so. First, he has no experience building trade association programs and, therefore, has done nothing to attempt to do so but, instead, has reverted to what he has always done - go out and press flesh. He needs to be in his office working - there's more than enough to do, but the grunt work of developing NLA programs is not in his repertoire. Second, Mazza is on too much of an ego trip, can't take criticism of any kind, and plays favorites - in other words, more of the same old same old. Mazza has been appointed to the position of a trade association executive. I know trade association executives, and Thomas "I" Mazza is not a trade association executive. I believe there was a time when he could have grown into such a role, but he has turned his back on that opportunity. So what you claim is undisputable, is very debatable. Eventually the jury will come in on this whole Bobit-Mazza experiment.

James H. Joseph
_Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars_
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Running for Mazza's position?? http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif
Sorry Jim, but that's how you came across... don't take it personal... but, why don't we (including myself) just stop speculating about the future of the "tree" and let the new seed grow so we can all see what the new "NLA tree" will look like and what it's all about. Of course we must always keep an eye out for "bugs and specially for termites" if we really want to have a healthy tree (NLA)...
Come on NLA members "Let's all work with what we have, some board members have experience others don't but, hey...it's not easy to be on a board of directors for free and run your business at the same time. Remember being a member of an organization is not just about complaining all the time about the same thing over and over again, it's about presenting ideas and helping out every once in a while, that's what really counts. Be a real member and when you have something to say to the NLA pick up the phone and talk to those in charge. If I don't like something or if I think that something is not done the right way, trust me, I will pick up the phone and voice my opinion and concerns."

Alex R.
Director Human Resources
Excel Worldwide, NY
alexr@excel-worldwide.com

you have missed a lot. Scroll back through the threads and you'll find a lot of things started because no one at NLA headquarters would return phone calls or communicate realistically in any way. You have also missed the numerous programs described in detail by not only me, but others, before you arrived on the scene. Thomas "I" Mazza asked for my input when he was inaugurated, then the first time it was offered (privately by e-mail, I might add) he couldn't take the criticism. His idea of communicating is to meet me at the Pittsburgh airport between his arrival from Philadelphia and departure for Denver (I guess where is hawking memberships) where, after passing through security, we could have talked for about two minutes.

Let's be realistic, Alex. No tree is going to grow from any seeds I've seen cast around. What have we seen in 1/3 of a year of Bobit management. The same supersilious LimoScene printed on expensive glossy paper that costs too much to mail, misrepresentations by the Executive Director of new memberships, no programs that give viability to the organization, hidden financial information, operation of NLA as a rogue organization without any regard for the members, the by-laws or the corporation law, and no accomplishments - oooppppsss, forgot about the new logo that got rid of that awful limousine silhouette. The most important part of any "new" administration is the first 90-100 days because that's when the die is cast, and that's when the momentum is developed. So far nothing has happened - we even have the same website that was thrown together two years ago.
You are quite wrong Alex about running to the "I" job. I not only have no interest, I am averse to any formal position and wouldn't run for a directorship if asked. I have said that before because if it were otherwise I would have no credibility. I have only one purpose (which has changed in the past two years), and that is to keep pointing out that NLA has no beef, that it's an empty bun, and that it must collapse because it offers nothing anybody wants to buy, and only when it is gone can a real association be built. NLA, as it is today, can never be liberated from its past, or even its present. You can join the ranks of the cheerleaders, but it's more important to field a winning team to cheer about.

Can you point out anything to cheer about in the past four months? NLA has spent how much money during that time to maintain an office, keep as staff, etc., which hasn't really accomplished anything.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Excel Worldwide:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JHJ:
to your assertion and questions.

There was a time when I believed that Tom could be good for the NLA. That time was when Darryl Norman was the president, the board was populated with people who had no clue about anything, and the management contract was expiring and NLA had a chance to do some intelligent things. But NLA didn't, some other people got on the board who had a clue but also had an agenda other than turning the NLA into a functioning and VIABLE national trade association, and I learned more about Thomas "I" Mazza.

Mazza has had enough experience in the industry to make a contribution to turning NLA into something viable, but two factors prevent him from doing so. First, he has no experience building trade association programs and, therefore, has done nothing to attempt to do so but, instead, has reverted to what he has always done - go out and press flesh. He needs to be in his office working - there's more than enough to do, but the grunt work of developing NLA programs is not in his repertoire. Second, Mazza is on too much of an ego trip, can't take criticism of any kind, and plays favorites - in other words, more of the same old same old. Mazza has been appointed to the position of a trade association executive. I know trade association executives, and Thomas "I" Mazza is not a trade association executive. I believe there was a time when he could have grown into such a role, but he has turned his back on that opportunity. So what you claim is undisputable, is very debatable. Eventually the jury will come in on this whole Bobit-Mazza experiment.

James H. Joseph
_Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars_
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Running for Mazza's position?? http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif
Sorry Jim, but that's how you came across... don't take it personal... but, why don't we (including myself) just stop speculating about the future of the "tree" and let the new seed grow so we can all see what the new "NLA tree" will look like and what it's all about. Of course we must always keep an eye out for "bugs and specially for termites" if we really want to have a healthy tree (NLA)...
Come on NLA members "Let's all work with what we have, some board members have experience others don't but, hey...it's not easy to be on a board of directors for free and run your business at the same time. Remember being a member of an organization is not just about complaining all the time about the same thing over and over again, it's about presenting ideas and helping out every once in a while, that's what really counts. Be a real member and when you have something to say to the NLA pick up the phone and talk to those in charge. If I don't like something or if I think that something is not done the right way, trust me, I will pick up the phone and voice my opinion and concerns."

Alex R.
Director Human Resources
Excel Worldwide, NY
alexr@excel-worldwide.com)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

dont any of you actually work?

since the apologists for the NLA and its board have posted their apologia here - what's NLA done since?

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Matt, They are still exclusive-not inclusive. It will be their downfall. Too bad-we need a strong National Limousine Association that is independent of the magazines. You have to do good with both hands, not one.

Dean Schuler

.

[This message was edited by AAA/GOT on September 28, 2002 at 05:48 PM.]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dean Schuler:
Matt, They are still exclusive-not inclusive. It will be their downfall. Too bad-we need a strong National Limousine Association that is independent of the magazines. You have to do good with both hands, not one.

Dean Schuler<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree with what you've said about "a strong NLA" and "doing good with both hands."

What exactly do you mean by "exclusive - not inclusive" ?

Is it a referance to Digest?

Have they been declining membership applications?

Only revealing financials to members?

Please elaborate, I just want to understand your meaning. Thanks.

Matt Harrison
AAA Guaranteed On-Time Limousine, Clinton NJ

Although it is a bright spot in NLA history that by-law amendments are slowly and apparently begrudgingly being made (the current proposals were pointed out by me over two years ago), although only about 5% of those needed have either been acted on or are under way, the proxy being solicited for the February meeting to modify the by-laws still leaves a big problem (which I also pointed out two years ago). Now that it is clear that oranizations rather than individuals are the members (duh!!!), the proposed amendments still leave open the question of who is designated by the organization to act on its behalf. There are many instances where partners are fighting or divorcing, or a company has been sold but voting rights retained by the seller to secure payment of the purchase price, or an owner becomes incapacitated, etc., etc. Any decent set of by-laws addresses the issue of who can vote for associations, except for NLA. Oh, well, maybe these will come a few years from now. Bobit and NLA directors are sure going to a lot of trouble to avoid making it look like maybe I was right when I proposed the new by-laws over two years ago. Well, whatever floats their boat.

For anybody who is interested in tracking my proposals two years ago, a complete set of the by-laws I proposed are contained on the forum where I posted them the better part of a year ago. Search on "by-laws" with author "JHJ" and you'll see the various articles posted on February 24, 2002.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bob1234:
dont any of you actually work?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I work, that's why you'll see me attempting to help people instead of pontificating about things that I neither have the ability, nor interest, to change. I view my membership in the NLA as more of a advertising channel than anything else, as the NLA seems to fart around with things that only a US-based company would care about. If I have a client who needs service elsewhere, I will try my contract services first, then the NLA book next. Hopefully that's at least what other NLA members are doing. I figure the pittance charged for membership I get back every year anyway. It's more a question of viewpoint for me as to the effectiveness of the NLA. I'm more interested in what the other members have to offer than the association's questionable projects.

Well said !! The cartel hasn't been an effective entity since the 1980's. Hell,they can't even count !! What we need to do as an Industry is do the National Advertising Campaign-with or without the cartel's backing. Every operator should join the TLPA, THE UNA, and the NLA, plus your local association ( if it has any sense ) Some states have "moron" associations-they are only open to the extreme " service-disabled ". So form your own association and roll wheels !! Let's get that National Advertising Campaign started now!!!!!!

Dean Schuler

[JHJ]

By now you should have received or will receive shortly a proxy solicitation for the proposed NLA by-law changes. Here's how I'm voting.

I'm giving my proxy to vote FOR the amendment to bill dues annually. This should have been done years ago, and probably would have been if I hadn't been the person criticizing the goofy system of rolling renewals on the membership anniversary.

I'm tendering my proxy to vote AGAINST the limitation on spending. How would you like to run your business if someone told you that you always had to have $150,000 in the bank? This is goofy. I understand that this is an attempt by present directors to limit the craziness of future directors, but it is inadvisable from two standpoints - first, who can run a business under such circumstances, and, second, the members get what they deserve. If they elect a board that bankrupts NLA, so be it. This is a lot like term limits for Congress or state legislatures. The problem lies with the voters, not the law. If you don't want an elected official after two terms, vote them out, don't try to force others to do the same. If the NLA board is reckless with the treasury, then they shouldn't have been elected in the first place, and throw them out. To limit spending in that manner is, in fact, just as goody as it sounds. I urge all members to bring some reason to this wacky amendment and vote AGAINST it.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

[JHJ]

Sorry, the word "goody" in the last line should have been "goofy." The reference to billing dues annually, should have said "on the same date for all members." Started new driver today, and I'm still talking to myself.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JHJ:
By now you should have received or will receive shortly a proxy solicitation for the proposed NLA by-law changes. Here's how I'm voting.

I'm giving my proxy to vote FOR the amendment to bill dues annually. This should have been done years ago, and probably would have been if I hadn't been the person criticizing the goofy system of rolling renewals on the membership anniversary.

I'm tendering my proxy to vote AGAINST the limitation on spending. How would you like to run your business if someone told you that you always had to have $150,000 in the bank? This is goofy. I understand that this is an attempt by present directors to limit the craziness of future directors, but it is inadvisable from two standpoints - first, who can run a business under such circumstances, and, second, the members get what they deserve. If they elect a board that bankrupts NLA, so be it. This is a lot like term limits for Congress or state legislatures. The problem lies with the voters, not the law. If you don't want an elected official after two terms, vote them out, don't try to force others to do the same. If the NLA board is reckless with the treasury, then they shouldn't have been elected in the first place, and throw them out. To limit spending in that manner is, in fact, just as goody as it sounds. I urge all members to bring some reason to this wacky amendment and vote AGAINST it.

James H. Joseph
_Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars_
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

[Dean Schuler]

LCT controls them. For that reason alone they need to go bye-bye !! Hit the Road Jack and don't give me your phony numbers no more, no more, no more !! Having MADE THAT STATEMENT-I agree with you Matt that we have a collection of exceptional NLA Directors now. I like that and I support the QUALITY DIRECTORS. Let's move the Industry forward now!!!!!!! Just don't count on their backers to correctly count-it has been proven that they don't possess the cognitive talents to perform that function of the higher mind. It is beyond them...SELAH!!!!!!!!!!

Dean Schuler