The End is Near . . .

Well, a month ago we learn that NLA is losing money (no surprise, of course), but now the board has decided to finish the organization off. We got a letter from Barbara Pastelak stating that the goofy board of directors of NLA, in all its usual wisdom, has decided to require all NLA members to not only provide NLA with a copy of its current insurance certificate and a schedule of vehicles, or, worse, have our insurance agent send NLA a certificate of insurance. This is, once and for all, going to tell us how dumb NLA members really are. It already tells us how dumb board members are.
First, there is no requirement in the by-laws that to be a member of NLA you have to be insured and prove it. This ridiculous action by the NLA board is far more than proving that you have insurance, this tells whoever wants to know where you get your insurance, how much you pay, your coverages and exactly what vehicles you have covered. Curt Andrews must be laughing his ass off that he'll have access to this information to sell insurance. Second, what does a member's vehicle schedule have to do with their insurance - there is obviously another purpose here (as there is in most things the NLA Board does, and it's sure to be anti-competitive or calculated to give somebody an advantage over someone else).
For our part, we're telling NLA to stick this "requirement" whre the sun doesn't shine. They'll get nothing from us about insurance or vehicles. Unfortunately, NLA members have an average IQ of 40 and most will probably actually provide this information. If enough members tell the baord to stick this requirement up their ass, the "requirement" will either go away, or NLA membership will plunge to a point where NLA will do the honorable thing and go out of business.
I'm volunteering legal representation to any NLA member who refuses to give this information to NLA if NLA tries to sanction the member in any way.
This is what happens when you elect people to the board who evidence the fact that they are growing a brain. The old "dumb" board shit on the members because they didn't know better. The new board knows that they're shitting on the members, but are doing it for someone's advantage.
The word needs to be spread to all NLA members to "Just Say No."
If this isn't stopped now, the next requirement will be a particular amount of insurance, and then a requirement that it has to be bought from a company with a certain Best's rating, etc., etc. Ultimately, you'll have to buy it from Curt Andrews.
John Sinibaldi, where were you when this ridiculous "requirement" was invented. Does someone have the balls to tell us what directors pushed this through?

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Maybe they will sell the information to Hartford so they can continue to endorse their wonderful insurance program "only offered to NLA members".

Limos.com requires proof of insurance from all new members as a measure to reduce liability issues. Perhaps the NLA has intent on competing with us in the consumer search area and they are doing this as a liability measure such as we did.

The NLA does offer consumer searches at their website. If a client secures service from the NLA website and an incident arises with an uninsured company, the NLA could have some type of problem. Not sure; as you know, I am not a lawyer.

Michael

PS: Jim, you are loosing your touch- I expected to see classic Jim verbage in the prior post "luddites", "ballyhooing", - you have transformed my vocabulary!
http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Michael -
This idea is so stupid that it doesn't deserve to be assailed in my usual manner - so, I decided I'd come down to the board's level with my word choice.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Does anybody think that Carey, Dav El, Empire, Boston Coach, Music and other similar-sized companies are going to cough up either their insurance endorsements, vehicle schedules or certificate of insurance? Of course they're not. This whole thing is calculated to purge the small operator and get leads to sell insurance. The large operators will simply ignore NLA, or simply tell the board to "go to hell," and who's going to throw any of these companies and the 4-figure dues and contributions out of a financially-ailing NLA

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Jim

I would like to address some concerns about the insurance requirements from NLA members.

1. This was not designed to produce leads for either Curt Andrew's or Hartford or any other insurance company.

I am on record on Limos.com that I am not a fan of the Hartford program. My company has been using "Northland" for many years. I would suggest that companies get quotes from Northland.

The sad fact is that we have members who have join the NLA and then let their insurance lapse. When an accident occurs with an uninsured company it makes the NLA and its members look bad. The consumer should have some confidence that the NLA symbol means something. Checking insurance binders for companies is just a safty factor.

2. We are not trying to get rid of small operators. My company has seven vehicles I don't have a problem providing my insurance certificate. In Fact, we have it posted in our office so the clients can look at it.

I have not heard of any problems for the large operators complying with this request. I have had positive comments from members because they knew of other NLA members who let their insurance lapse.

Jim, let's have a good exchange for the benefit of the readers.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

John -
You're off base. First, having insurance is not a requirement for NLA membership. Read the by-laws. Second, having proof of insurance is a whole different thing than providing a copy of your endorsements and a vehicle schedule. I notice you side-stepped the real issue. I want some director to defend trying to get a copy of the endorsements and a schedule of vehicles. As I said, it won't be coming from us and I'll volunteer to defend any member who joins in in refusing this information. Proof of insurance may be a reasonable request, but it cannot be compelled. To go further is an unwarranted intrusion and clearly has an ulterior purpose, John although you may not be in the loop of what that purpose is. If we want a good exchange for the members, let's address the issues. Now that you told us you have proof of insurance displayed in your office, tell us why NLA should know the vehicles covered, the VIN numbers, the year, the manufacturer, the capacity, the cost per vehicle of the insurance, the deductible, the additional insured (which will tell NLA where vehicles are financed or leased and even what networks and, in some cases, clients, the member deals with) and the many other facts that are contained in the "required" information. You have to be a fool to provide this information, and I've been called a lot of things, but "fool" is not one of them.
And what is this crap that the "consumer" should have confidence that the NLA seal should mean something. Since when did a national trade association become a "seal" of anything. This little slip of the tongue reveals why most members join NLA - to get get an apparent competitive advantage over other companies that are not members. That is the sum and substance of NLA - how to screw the other guy - and that's why NALA (once we get it going) will be, and why TLPA is, a much better organization. NLA is built on divisiveness and anti-competitive motives - the association is "used" be whoever can control it at any moment to beat up the competition, whether it be another member or a non-member, and the changing composition of the board is nothing more than evidence of this fact. Nothing changes except who is going to get screwed.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
[EMAIL]jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com[/EMAI

[This message was edited by JHJ on June 08, 2001 at 08:04 AM.]

My Insurance covers any vehicle. I think I could handle faxing one piece of paper.

I just received my letter demanding the insurance information to be sent to the NLA. As a result of the information provided in this forum, I wasted no time in ripping it up. If the NLA does not like it, they can prorate my membership fee and send it back. I promise to do the same to the NLA stickers. It's just none of their business. If any of my customers, or potential customers request my insurance information, they are welcome to it.

Jim & Limos 4 U

Two simple reasons for the insurance requirement.

1. To verify that members maintain insurance.
2. To verify how many vehicles a member is running. Its seems we have members who pay their dues based on 1-5 vehicles when in fact they have more. The binder simply states the number of vehicles the member has insured.

It is always nice to get nailed from you Jim. I don't take it personal. Thanks for the help on the software issues. The end is not near. If any NLA members have been following this form, I would request that you contact me and give me your feelings on this subject, and I will take the time to explain all the facts. This request was not designed to give leads to insurance agents. No one is asking for premiums that are paid on your policy just asking that a company has insurance and the numbers of vehicles they have, so that the correct dues are being accessed.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

[This message was edited by fivestaroregon on June 10, 2001 at 02:25 AM.]

John -
You are missing the fundamental issue involved. There is NO requirement for membership in NLA that a member have any insurance at all, no matter how much wishful thinking you or the rest of the board engages in. Moreover, is there any state in which you can register a livery vehicles and NOT have insurance? Assuming, arguendo, that there is some valid reason for NLA "requiring" insurance (I submit there is not), then THAT STATE is where the attention should be focused.
An insurance endorsement DOES NOT show the number of vehicles being insured except at that moment in time. Supplemental endorsements change that number frequently during a year as vehicles are added and deleted. The endorsements do, however, show the additional insureds, which range from the entities financing or leasing vehicles, to networks to which the member belongs, to larger customers.
I supect that the board members have never looked at their insurance endorsements and, if they have, they certainly don't understand them. No, there is something more at work here than making sure that a member has insurance (which NLA does not require for membership), or verifying the number of vehicles - there is far too much overkill.
Want to know whether a member is paying dues based on the true number of vehicles - publish the vehicles range in the annual directory (annual directory? - we all remember the annual directory, don't we - the book that NLA USED to publish annually but now doesn't publish at all, presumably from lack of funds that were diverted to the certification program) and competitors in the member's city will be quick to tell you whether the member is payin the proper amount of dues. Besides, knowing how many vehicles a member is operating (by range) is useful to other members looking to refer business.
Sorry, John, either you're being disingenous or you've been duped by those on the board who have other motives for "requiring" the insurance information.
Question for those in the forum - do you know of any state where you can register a livery vehicles without insurance?? What this is a precursor to is telling members "how much" insurance they have to have.
By the way, does anybody know of any accident involving a livery vehicle anywhere in the world where there was a lack of insurance or underinsurance? Does the NLA board know of any? Of course not!!! This is a red-herring for other motives, plain and simple.
Notice that no board member (a number of whom appeared here ballyhooing why they should be elected to the board but whom have since done a disappearing act) has or can respond to the issues raised concerning this insurance "requirement."
What is the problem? Who doesn't have insurance? Is there any state that doesn't require insurance? This is all another half-baked plan by certain members of NLA to take advantage of others, and John has bought into it hook line and sinker

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

I sat with Barbara Pastelak at the awards dinner in Vegas. I was a finalist for Operator of the Year (medium div). I sat with all the NLA people at their table quite by chance. I am not an NLA member. The members stated how "rare" it is for a "non-NLA member to be considered for the award". I walked away as a finalist and not the winner and wondered if by chance I didn't get it because I am not a member. I wonder if the winner IS a member of NLA. Barbara asked me why I was not a member. My response was that I do not care to share sensitive information such as fleet schedules or insurance schedules with outside sources which could hurt me in the long run. I already have a competitor in my town who's only advantage is he has only been in business for two years and thus has the "largest fleet of NEW cars in town" (all two of them). Why give someone ammunition in print to show that, yes, I am still running a five year old car. The other reason is I see no tangible benefit that the NLA can offer me in Bakersfield, California. I was already a finalist for Operator of the Year (without them). I already work for Music Express, CLS, Carey and other smaller networks that send business my way. I have my own one week classroom training program for chauffeurs which has served me well for eleven years. We have a very low turn-over rate. Most of our drivers have been with us for five to seven years. If the true reason for wanting to know this information is to determine the level of cars, my question would be why? Are you, the NLA, going to provide more assistance to me because I have more cars? Are you going to send me more business because I have more cars? What difference does it make? Why not charge one flat fee for membership that is reasonable to everyone? Then you wouldn't have to worry about who is cheating on their reporting. Under the current system, NLA assumes that if a company has a lot of cars, they should pay a bigger fee. There should be no more or less representation for a company with two cars or two hundred cars. If you are a member, you are a member. All this time, I thought I was being petty to not joining for the sole reason that I will not share my fleet information in such detail with NLA. I am so glad to see that I am not alone!

Just to clear up a few points. The NLA is asking to be named a certificate holder. The certificate states the following:

1. The policy number.
2. Effective date.
3. The number of vehicles plus hired cars.
4. Vin numbers

The certificate does not show the amount of premiums that are being paid.

Once again, this is to verify that NLA operators do have insurance and if the policy is cancelled , the NLA will be notified.

No information is shared with vendors. You are right Jim, this is not in the bylaws but it's coming. In Oregon, we do not have a livery plate. Anybobdy can run a limo company. The State does very little to monitor our business.

I am still waiting for NLA operators who are concerned about showing their insurance to call me. So far the phone is silent, however, I understand the office staff at NLA are buried in insurance certificates. I guess the end is not near.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member
Vendor Liason Chair

[This message was edited by fivestaroregon on June 14, 2001 at 07:41 PM.]

[This message was edited by fivestaroregon on June 14, 2001 at 07:43 PM.]

John -
Remember what I said - this will tell us just how stupid NLA members really are. If you are correct and the staff is buried with insurance papers, then my fears are justified - there is no hope for the NLA with the level of stupidity evidenced by the members. We'll see what comes in the by-laws and whether they are legally changed or not, since nothing that has happened as long as I've been watching is in conformity with the by-laws, including the last election or how vacancies have been filled.
You are still ducking the issue, John. True that a certificate shows what you say it shows, but the letter asks for far more than a certificate - it asks for the endorsements, which contains all of the information I said it does. John, you need to deal in whole truths instead of the half truths you've been throwing out here. Also, the VIN numbers tell you the year, make and model of car.
When pigs fly we'll give NLA this information. We're insured, our state requires it, and if someone trys to throw us out of NLA we'll deal with it in court. Looks like we're coming back to where all this started very quickly. This renegade board is no better than any other that we've had yet, except it will preside over the demise of the association.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Jim

I am not trying to duck the issue. We should not be asking for an endorsement. I will be on the phone to the NLA Home office tomorrow.

A certificate holder is all that is needed. I will be in touch tomorrow with the results.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

Jim

Got a call from Joey this weekend. It seems that I have been more concerned about insurance than the number of vehicles that a member has. Case in point "The Top Fify" Frankly, I could care less about how big a company is. What I am more concerned about is that members do maintain insurance. You are right, Vin numbers should not be asked nor endorsements. I will be reviewing the letter that went out to members to address the concerns voiced by other members.

John Sinibald
NLA Board Member

Nothing but a crock. There is more important things like if you reverse Paulie Walnuts last name you get STUNLAW. Now thats important!

I have been waiting since June 17th when you were going to "check" on the status of the endorsements/schedule of vehicles. I have since received another solicitation from the NLA to join which specifically states I must provide a "schedule of vehicles". To me, that is the list from the insurance company that has each car, the make/model/year and vin #. It is this paper that keeps so many from joining the NLA. I have spent a great deal of time working with Barry Lefkowitz and the NLA to get Bill Thomas to tour Krystal and meet with NLA re: the gas guzzler tax. Mr. Thomas is based in my home town and his campaign manager is one of my best clients. Currently, as the Chair of the House Ways & Means Committee has the ability to make this tax go away. And I'm not even a member! But, maybe someday, if we can get an answer to what really is needed, I will be. What is the answer that I have been waiting for for 11 days?

I hope all that are watching the NLA issue in this forum realize that John demonstrates the lack of ability of the NLA to even provide the information promised regarding the need for an endorsement. If the board of directors can't keep their word about "getting back to us", I am no longer in need of the information. The NLA has now demonstrated why I have not felt the need to join.

I just received the following email. It was in response to an email I sent the NLA refusing to provide the insurance information. Upon receipt of this email, I responded with another. My latest email stated that if this was a requirement for membership, the NLA should refund a pro-rated share of what I paid and cancel my membership.


To: Robert Schwartz:
Prestige Transportation Service

From: Chris Horsley
RE: Insurance Certificate
Date: July 13, 2001

It is the vision of the NLA Board of Directors that NLA members be touted as the most reliable,
satisfactory, most professional limousine operators in the industry. Accordingly, it is necessary to strengthen the requirements of membership so that NLA can stand behind its members with confidence.

Once this vision is achieved, we benefit as a team because NLA members will be held to a higher regard by consumers.

During a recent meeting of the NLA Board of Directors a new policy was established requiring all active US members to provide NLA with a copy of its current insurance certificate and most recent schedule of vehicles and update this information annually. The simplest way to do this is to request your insurance company to list the NLA as a certificate holder. The insurance company will then provide the NLA with an
updated certificate annually.

Following is the address to provide to your insurance company:

The National Limousine Association
2365 Harrodsburg Road, Suite A325
Lexington, KY 40504


Thank you for your cooperation.

And here is the NLA's latest response. Note to Limos.Com, can you please a middle finger icon http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Robert, we are very sorry that you feel this way. If you want us to cancel your membership, we will
do so.

The board of directors feels that providing proof of insurance is important in that the NLA office
provides a great number of referrals each day, both over the telephone and via the web site. This is the only means we have of ensuring that the companies we refer customers are meeting minimum
statutory requirement. That is the only reason this request was made and the insurance information requested is kept completely confidential and never shared.

The NLA bylaws do not permit the refunding of dues paid, however and any cancellation would be
made with this understanding.

Regards,

Chris Horsley
Director of Membership

Don't give these people the satisfaction of resigning - besides we're going to need as many people as possible to sue NLA when they try to terminate memberships. There is no requirement for membership in the by-laws that requires proof of insurance or proof of number of vehicles. Tell them to stick it up their ass. What is the "minimum statutory requirement" that they are talking about? If there is a statutory requirement, how did NLA become the self-appointed cop? A few weeks ago I asked the question about state requirements, and I got a reply from John-Now-Silent-NLA-Director-Sinibaldi that said some states don't require insurance to register vehicles. Come on, I didn't fall off a turnip truck yesterday. This is all horseshit.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

the ways these morons invoke the by-laws to deny you a refund of your dues, but not in connection with insurance. There are no by-laws for NLA - they are just a convenience or inconvenience, as the case may be, depending on what these idiots want to try to do at any given moment. This is what Scott Solombrino brought to the NLA! Scroll back to see what he would say to get elected, and check out what he's doing now. By the way - anybody heard from Scott in this forum in the last half-year???? And, also by the way, does anybody remember when NLA used to publish an annual membership directory. Perhaps they don't want anyone to know how membership has dropped, and they sure don't want anyone using the directory to read the by-laws or make phone calls or send e-mail to other members. We're all mushrooms now - they keep us in the dark and shovel shit on our heads.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

I responded that since there would be no refund, I would just keep my membership active and then not join up next year. And that they had not right to cancel my membership based on rules inacted after I joined.

I'm surprised the NLA did'nt come up with a minimum on their new insurance requirement. It does'nt seem very fair to booster to the public that a member has insurance if the holder only has 10-20-10. Never mined they may not even be permitted in their area. We have operators in our area that have some vehicles properly insured and permitted and some of their vehicles are not. Who will the public feel more comfortable with a company with a million or a company with 5 million?

Hey Jim - Glad to see someone else noticed how fast John Sinibaldi clammed up. One day he is going to "check it out" for us and the next day, he is just gone. I have no problem providing a certificate of insurance naming NLA as additionally insured (IF I was a member) but I have no plans to share with them my VIN's, my yearly premiums or other information contained in a "schedule" which is what they are requesting. As an Operator of the Year 2001, runner up, I know I am running a good business and that schedule isn't going to validate my operations any more that LCT has done by issuing me a beautiful plaque/certificate for my wall. As I watch this issue unfold on this forum, my gut instinct of NLA is slowly being realized. I have always had this perception that NLA is a small group, no, a better word would be clique of people who think they are God's gift of the limousine world, the knowledge of how things should be, what is right and wrong. From everything I keep reading here, that is what they are. I might also add the word snobby to that. I truly felt that they all hung out in Vegas together looking down their noses at those who were not members, such as me in particular. Well hey NLA, speak up and answer some questions for all of us. How many members do you have? Just how many referrals do you provide to your members on each business day. I am sure as a business this would be a stat you would monitor daily just as Chambers of Commerce across the U.S. do. Are your complete bylaws published on your web site? If not, why not and when can we expect them to be there? Since you hide behind these "bylaws" in almost every response, let's see the whole damned thing in print to allow those of us who are not members to scrutinize you, as you wish to scrutinize us. The only reponse I am looking for should come from an NLA board member. Specifically I would love to hear from Barbara Pastelak.

Greetings everyone

Sorry for the absense. I had some personal family issues to deal with and my commitee "Vendor Liaison" and I have been working on numerous requests from NLA members needing help on several issues. The number one issue so far has been helping members collect money from other members on Farm-outs.

Now for the Insurance issue: First of all Jim, with all due respect, I don't recall making a statement that "Not all States require insurance binders".

Again, the request for the insurance certificate is to verify that our members have insurance and that the number of vehicles they operate matches up to the dues structure.

Jim, I do agree with you that the by-laws don't address this issue yet, I am frustrated that it has taken so long to get the revise by-laws on the front burner. None of the insurance information sent in is shared with other insurance vendors and in paticular "Curt Andrew".

I am willing to discuss this question, however I do feel that some of you have made up your mind on this issue. As an NLA member, are you not conern if another company in your town is operating as an NLA member without insurance, permits etc? What do you think the response should be? My commitee gets letters from members filing complaints against other members on a number of issues. Money owed, False adversting, etc. What do you want me as a Board Member to do about it?

I will be checking in on a regular basis or anyone can call me.

I appreciate Limos.com for providing a forum for issues.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member
Chair/Vendor Liaison

PS to Limoscene

I am confused with your statement. An additional insured does not show the premiums paid. My agent tells me that the certificate does show the Date of the policy, Insured amount, Ending date, Vin numbers. Our airport in Oregon must see the Vin numbers to approve the vehicle. You say you will provide proof of insurance, but the additional issue does list the vin numbers.Have you discussed this with your agent. Better yet, give me a call on the Toll free number 1-800-517-9555.Let's go over the facts.

Thanks
John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

If the NLA is really worried about if a company is properly insured, I suggest a copy of your certificate of insurance that goes to your regulators.
This not only tells them your insured and somebody locally is monitoring, but also that you hold the proper license to work your area.

I like the comment about the NLA/Host office referring customers, I wonder how they pick out a company /companies when they have more then one member in an area?

I have been a member many years and no one has ever said they got my name from the NLA office, so my take is this:

1) No one ever calls their office for a referral but this was the only thing they can think of to tell their members why they want a certificate.
(so I'm pissed)

2) All the referrals have gone to the local Carey "crash" Limousine with their NLA/Pinnacle safety certified no dose eaten drivers or more recently to Scotty "the body" Solombrino and his Dav El Salvador buddies.
( which still pisses me off)

More on the Carey problem later gotta go for now my Gombas.

I understood your June 10 reply to this thread to be that in Oregon you can register vehicles without insurance. If it doesn't mean that, then what did that reply mean? The question put was "is there any state where you can register livery vehicles without insurance," and your reply was that in Oregon you don't have livery plates and the state does very little to regulate the livery business. I admit that I may have misinterpreted this oblique answer to the question, so I'll ask it again: Why is NLA appointing itself a cop when I don't believe that there is any state where you can own a limousine and have license plates (livery OR otherwise) issued without proof of insurance? More on the point, when has any NLA member EVER in the past not had insurance and operated limousines transporting members of the public? I submit that the answers are NONE and NEVER and I challenge NLA to point out a problem in this area. This whole thing is a subterfuge for something else. Next will come the amount of insurance you have to have. After that will come that you have to have insurance with an "NLA approved" insurance company. And finally, NLA will approve only insurance companies represented by Curt Andrews. This is all such nonsense that it defies common sense. Is there ANYBODY out there that thinks that this is a problem and a LEGITIMATE concern of NLA?

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

In the words of that old song "Has anybody seen my old pal Scotty"?????

Since being elected, Mr. Solombrino's voice has become almost non-existent. Has he been kidnapped by aliens?????

My, my how things haven't changed - unless you consider all the new insurance solicitations by the NLA.

AS MUCH AS THINGS CHANGE - THEY SURE REMAIN THE SAME.

We are going to have a contest. First person that posts the location or hears from "Scotty The Body" will win a free limo ride from a Carey safety certified driver in Indianapolis.

Does anyone have a link to the story about the accident in Indy -- I am looking for a newspaper account.

http://www.limos.com/limoforumgraphics/bbtitle_small.gif

Michael -

The URL's to each of these stories are long because they are achived. The occurrence was about June 19, 2001. However, you can get there easily by doing the following:
<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI>Go to www.msnbc.com (http://www.msnbc.com) and in the search window put "limousine indianapolis" and it will take you to two stories along with a color photo of the limo
<LI>Go to www.theindychannel.com (http://www.theindychannel.com) and in the search window type "limousine crash" and it will take you to two stories
[/list]

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

There are reports that Scott Solombrino was seen briefly in Rapid City, South Dakota . . . at the local Starbucks sipping latte with Elvis.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Just got my directory in the mail and did a quick look see. I got a chuckle when reading the adorning the By-Laws Section. Every vehicle shown is a non-QVM limousine. Wonder what the folks of LIMO will think about that.

After my little laugh, I went to the airport listings. Under Tampa airport, my smile disappeared. I don't know who to be more angry with the NLA or all the illegal companies that listed. Of the 24 companies listed under Tampa International Airport, approx 8 are illegal and not licensed to operate at the airport, 1/3 of the listing.

If I remember correctly, when info for the directory was being gathered you could list the airports you service. I guess AA Best Transportation, Ashley's Limousine, Atlantis Limousine, Dana's Limousine, Goldstar Limousine, IBEX Towncar Service, VIP Limo and Wheels to Wings Transportation got confused as to what airport they serve. I thought to be a member of the NLA you had to follow and have some level of ethics. Guess I was wrong.

I don't know how much of the blame to put on the NLA but I would think some level of review could have been made. The NLA has asked for insurance certificates - why don't they require certification from the licensing authority before a company can be listed under an airport.

We just received the new NLA membership book, nice try but a BONER!!!!
Section listings by town and airport!!!!

Maybe the NLA should have listened about getting a copy of the insurance certificate that each company provides to their regulators and not worry about naming themselves, at least they would know if the company is licensed properly.

In Tampa / TPA 24 companies listed (9) (Nine) yes (1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1=9) out of the 24 are not licensed to pick up in Tampa. 1 is even from Jacksonville.

Brilliant move!!!

Hey Hesch, Big Pussy anybody want to list the companies .
Wait until the local PTC gets a copy of this one.

Insurance certificate my achen a-----.

Oh heres another one for you John, in the association section the Florida Livery Association which is a for profit company and not recognized by the state group (FSGTO) was removed as an eligible association by the NLA last year is again in the new book. Gee I wonder who's behind this one.

I wonder what would happen if every member of the real Florida group decided to not renew or quit the NLA because of it.
Hey Scott remember the group that helped you get elected..........

Well just when I thought I could rest, some scungile calls my name.
First you guys liten up on mikey c, he'll do right by you guys.
I am surprised somewhat that Scotty let that Gonzalez guy listed back in the association section, but remember he is Barry boys puppet.
What you should be worried about is the statement by your NLA director Baby Bruce Cottew in the indianapolis newspaper, and I'll quote the article, Cottews group, which represents more than 1800 (?) limousine companies nationwide, is pushing FEDERAL LEGISLATION requiring the U.S. Department of Transportation to regulate limousines like it does over the road trucks.
Limousine operators are far less regulated than truck drivers and even some cab drivers.
He even makes reference to Florida (gee I wonder where that comes from).
I thought the NLA was preaching less federal regulations, another brilliant thing to say to the press. Wheres Bob Scott when you need him!!! At least he would say the right things most of the time.
Another thing I thought you guys said that NLA certification thing was dead. How come Celebrity limousine advertises they have NLA certified chauffeurs.
Nothing new.
Sorry there John
Big Pussy B.

There more than grits simmering in the pot down south, and I believe its NLA soup. Stay tuned because this could get interesting if the fire is not turned off on this movement.

These NLA people could f**k up an anvil. And they want insurance information! They can't be trusted to do anything right. Same with Pittsburgh as with elsewhere - they have people listed who do not hold airport permits, and they list our general aviation airport (about 10 air miles away from the international airport) and only have two companies listed there when NO permit is required for that airport. Wonder how many bad phone and fax numbers there are, and how many bad web and e-mail addresses there are.
Michael must be laughing up his sleeve, because he's been through all this and knows how difficult it is - which is why the morons at NLA should never attempt such directory classifications.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Are you asking me to propose that NLA members provide documents on which Aiports they are approve to service? I think this is a very good suggestion. I can tell you are upset over this and I have to say so would I.

I am puzzled by the negative reaction I have read concerning the insurance certificate. I am sure the same people would be against this review.

I will discuss this matter next week with other Board Members. As for the NON-QVM ad in the book, all I can say to that is "Lack of comunication from HOST". The Board is not happy with this situation but nothing can be done until next year.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

This looks like another "HOST problem". That assoication was removed last year, it should not have been placed in that part of the directory. I will be talk to Carolyn about this.

RFP's have been sent out either choosing a new management company or renewing with HOST. The last count I have was 68 proposals went out.

Will keep you all informed.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

P.S Ragu. Still waiting for your call. You have your opportunity to talk. You can still keep your code name, I am sure we can have a good dialog on issues that benefit the NLA and the industry. The number again is 1-800-517-9555. Anytime http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

I was upset when I received that article with the statement from Bruce. However he denied making those exact statements. I am going to try to attach the response letter he sent to the paper.

Bruce claims his statements were taken out of context by the writer covering this accident.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

PS. I am giving you the same invitation to call me anytime. Keep your code name. Since I am the only Board member who visits limos.com I can certainly give you my ear.
1800-517-9555 http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

(PS: Message edited to remove vulgar title)

[This message was edited by XENEFOX Media Corporation / Limos.com on July 21, 2001 at 03:38 PM.]

John, I appreciate your p.s. to me recently and regret I have not had time to call you. You were confused about my comment about "certificate of insurance". I offered that to prove that I am insured. What more does the NLA need to know other than I am insured for 2.5 million dollars?
Per your last post, I would gladly send a copy of my contract to operate at LAX. I would be happy to send NLA a copy of our Operating Authority from the PUC. I can't see the relevance of anything else beyond those documents. I will have my insurance agent send a letter telling you my premium has been paid for the time period on my certificate of insurance.

Moving on, as a member of the board of numerous organizations in my community, we approve everything that is considered a major expense. I would expect that printing directories would be a major expense and the type of errors people are discussing here indicates no one actually reviewed a "proof" and said to HOST, yes, this thing looks great, the information is accurate and it's ready to print.

I asked you to reveal specific things including the number of active members as of this date, the complete bylaws and the average number of referrals made by NLA daily or weekly. Could you please provide that information here. This is a second request.

The last thing to be said is an apology for my perception of the NLA members/board being snobby. I asked my wife if she felt that way as she was by my side the entire conference and felt that it wasn't really snobby as much as it was trying to cram down our throat how important it was for us to be NLA members and an implication that because we were not members we were just a notch below those who were.

I agree with limoscene. I would have no problem providing proof that I'm insured (only one million on my policy) or that my premium is paid in full till Oct 15th. Providing proof of Airport Authorization would not be a problem, either. My problem is with an SS-type investigation of my company. I have not seen one response indicating a problem of proving insurance. The only negative responses I've noticed have to do with VIN numbers, etc.
As for the unfortunate Carey accident, I've seen no gleeful posts on that either. No safety certifications will help if the company unsafely uses their personnel. Once upon a time, I worked for a big taxi outfit. We'll refer to them as company "Y". They mercilessly pushed me to extreme limits. As extreme as 43 straight driving hours. One advantage to this, is that I will never overdrive any of my employees. Perhaps the NLA could survey its members for average hours on the roaad per driver. If an honest answer is given, you might be shocked. Better yet, divide their vehicles, into drivers, into income.

Hi John I am sure wrong or right everybody appreciates you coming on.
What the other guys are complaining about goes back along time. Its always a "somebody didn't catch it" answer. The limo magazines would say the story slipped by, it wont happen again. The NLA has used and abused that answer also. People are tired of all the garbage, now your executive director was misquoted, by a reporter that doesn't have a clue about any of this. No John I would have to beieve he said what he said.
Another thing about all my friends with the Soprano style names most of this crew has talked to you in person at different times,as Ragu said whats the big deal with the names. By the way I don't know what was edited, but you spelled my buddy Big Pussy's last name wrong.
Hey Michael do you have a problem with the names that have been used, or are you just happy somebody speaks out.

Hello

1. Active members with the NLA.

The numbers given me today were the following:

Operators: 1550
Vendors & Misc 200

2. How are referrals handled:

When consumers call the NLA office, they are sent to the web page to look up NLA members in their city. If the client does not have internet access, then a fax is sent to them if they are requesting service in a large city that has numerous members. If the city is small like "Lexington" the consumer is giving the members over the phone.

I will have to wait to get the average number of calls per week.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

Hello

I guess when I used the Big P. name as listed, I was censored. I hope I did not offend anyone. Michael edited my Title on the post.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by fivestaroregon:
Hello

I guess when I used the Big P. name as listed, I was censored. I hope I did not offend anyone. Michael edited my Title on the post.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, I removed the Big "Pu$$Y" comment from the title. Please try to use this language sparingly? No content was altered. Thanks
http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.limos.com/limoforumgraphics/bbtitle_small.gif

Attached is the NLA Letter which John Sinibaldi asked me to post...

http://www.limos.com/limoforumgraphics/bbtitle_small.gif

[This message was edited by XENEFOX Media Corporation / Limos.com on July 24, 2001 at 08:58 PM.]

If I represented the Indianapolis Star and they brought this letter to me and asked if they had any liability and if they should do anything in response, my answer would be "No" and "No." This is a pretty lame letter with no pointed issues raised that would clearly indicate the reporter was off the reservation. I think that Cottew was off the reservation.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by XENEFOX Media Corporation / Limos.com:
Attached is the NLA Letter which John Sinibaldi asked me to post...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

As we all get useless emails and false and misleading hopes from Missi, how many really believe these emails that imply the government is going to do anything. Not to fault the Feds they can't bail every business out, but get real the Coach Builders? They weren't selling cars in August, what was the problem then? Cars are being repo'd or just turned in faster than you can fill up the gas tanks, does anybody beleave this is because of 3 bad weeks? Limo's have been overpriced for 5 years we are to feel for them, get real # 2. Gas guzzler tax, the only ones that care are the big guys. When the smaller companies buy or lease a car the 12 or 18 hundred is spread over 5 years who cares, the big boys do. Waste of time for most! Aid, yea you (might) be in line for a low interest loan, thats loan, yes you have to pay it back.Barry and his boys continue to blow smoke, you guys watch and see who benefits if anybody!!! The NLA has extended payment of renewal dues, thats because nobody was renewing.
Who was the brilliant one to tell the feds about the poor independant operators that don't qualify for unemployment? Could this be a Scotty the Body move to futher leveling the playing field with other big companies. Hummm, who are we looking out for!!!!!
New board! new headlines! new nothings!My dues are up soon, for good.

Just sitting hear reading some of Ragu's previous comments and basically have to agree. The sudden flood of emails from the NLA has done nothing except clog the lines. To make the gas guzzler tax a priority item at this time is a joke. Getting rid of it now will provide not one bit of help to the majority of the industry - NO ONE IS BUYING ANY CARS! Long term, thats another story - as always it will help the big guys Davel, Carey, etc... When you buy a lot of cars, that $1,500 extra per vehicle can quickly add up to a bunch of bucks. For the small I don't think it really matters. If you can afford to purchase a new limo, that extra few dollars is not going to stop you.

My second thought for what it's worth is "WHY ARE WE TRYING TO BAIL OUT THE LIMO MANUFACTURERS"?
These guys have been in trouble before Sept 11th.
In 10 years in the business I have never received so many emails and phone calls peddling limos. The recent tragedy is not what put a hurt on these guys - its that the industry started to go into the dump 6 months ago. Why is the NLA taking up the fight for the limo manufacturers - I thought we were an association of limousine operators. Why isn't the lobbying effort being focused on us.
If manufacturers are in trouble because of the bad business decisions they made - don't use Sept 11th as a reason for bailing them out.

The NLA for the big guys always and forever.

First RSM Gas Guzzler tax.
First I'm a small operator and yes the gas guzzler hurts why? When a limo is financed (generally the norm is about 4 years) that $1500 tax that you paid has now become $3800 if not more. If you feel that close to $4000 is nothing then let me know. I'll give you my mailing address and you can send me a check for 4 grand. http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif I don't know about you but 4 grand can be used towards a down payment on a new limo etc.

Second: In regards to coachbuilders the reason that sales are so slow is not because the industry is falling dramatically or because of Sept 11th. I have spoken with many of them. The main reason is that because Lincoln is coming out with TWO DIFEERENTLY DESIGNED Town cars within three years time. (The second one being completely redesigned)That is whats killing them. Who with a business mind would want to buy a car and then the following year it is considered the old model.

Third: If you honestly think that Sept 11th hasn't hurt the industry then you are sadly mistaken. I don't know if you have a lot of corporate clients but if you do then you MUST have felt an impact. For example: A company in the area has stopped all unecessary travel by air till further notice. For one company that meant a cancellation of over 300 hundred runs for just the first three weeks after the events on Sept. 11th transpired. He has had to lay off people. The conditions at the airport in Detroit are at its worst for limousine procedures.

Fourth: What the NLA is doing in Washington can only be a plus. When was the last time you heard the word limousines during senate and congress hearings on CSPAN. NEVER! The NLA is putting the industry under a light. It may be small light but at least it's a start. I know in Michigan that if one of our companies call their Reps. They get a response. Why? Because for the last two years we as a state association have lobbied our butts off. Now when we say something they listen. The problem is that other state associations do not do the same. Can you imagine that if every state limo association worked hard at lobying the interests of their local industry we would ONE have a stronger national association and TWO actually have a say on how we should and do conduct business.

Nkokas:

I too am a small operator - if the extra $1500
was costing $4000 over 48 months I would find a new source of money - you are being ripped off big time. My point was that the constant push to get the gas guzzler repealed is a big time benefit to the large companies if it gets pulled off. I don't like paying extra money for a limo either but the overall impact to me or other small operators is not as great as the impact to the large guys. Who do you think continues to push this issue while other issues are not addressed.

My other point you seem also to have missed. Whatever the reason for the limo manufacturers problems, we are an association of limousine operators not manufacturers. Spend my time and money addressing my issues not the manufacturers.

Still disagree

ONE:The 48 months is what the national average length for limousine commercial loans are.
TWO: people who finance this 1500 or possibly more depending on the veicle can go as high as 4000. I can guarantee it. It doesn't mean they took a 48 month loan it was probably more.
THREE:Yes the manufactures DO effect YOU. Why? Because if they have to pay more out of their pocket then YOU have to pay more out of your pocket when you buy one of their limos. I guess your gonna say that the airlines have nothing to do with us as well.
Four: The association is an association for the limo INDUSTRY. Whether you are a limo operator, a manufacturer, or a limo search engine like limos.com we are all effected somewhere down the road if there is a dramatic change in any one of the respective fields. It's what's known as the trickle down effect.Why do you think airline companies become members of the hotels associations or the hotels become part of the airports associations. Here are two different industries that are dependent enough on each other that they look out for each others interests.

Unfortunately the limo industry is not that way. Probably because "JHJ said best"
most people in the industry are non educated People are to busy trying to outbid eachother instead of getting involved with the industry. The stronger the industry is as a whole will yield you beiong stronger as an individual

The Gas Guzzler Tax needs to go. We are the only industry that has to pay such a tax. The tax was enacted nearly ten years ago to cover cuts in special needs services. Many in Congress didnt even know this tax was still on the books. Big or small, eliminating this tax will help companies.

As far as deferring dues. Ragu, Please, you were not on the conference call. We voted to defer dues to help out companies caught up with the attack of Sept 11th. Information given to me shows the NLA membership being down about 100. Total members is around 1649.

I want the NLA next year to work on providing education to our members and to continue with legistlation that benefits our industry. If I run for President these would be the foundation of my platform.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member
Vendor Commitee

You guys that think of the NLA and Cheerios in the same sentence, get real.
I want anybody to post anything the NLA has done to benefit them for, lets say only the last 5 years.
I'll start.

The NLA helped the GLLA fight the cabbies in the Detroit area where they wanted to lock out limos.

Here's two:

The NLA is helping us with our current fight with the airport.

Give me a break. I sick of NLA bashing. What have YOU done for the industry.

who seems to work tirelessly on behalf of NLA members, I have been wondering why we aren't hearing much anymore about the antics at NLA. Then I started wondering why I haven't felt the urge to post their antics, either. Then it hit me. NLA has trivialized itself. There is really nothing to say. Reminds me of the "Clang Bird." Anybody else remember the Clang Bird? A Clang Bird flies in ever-decreasing concentric circles until it disappears up its own *** with a tremendous "CLANG." Can it finally be written about NLA - C-L-A-N-G!!!!

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

The Board does it again, how is it possible the board (not Scott) did not vote for LCT to become the new management company of the NLA.
Is it because LCT is a well run and profitable company and has the means for exposure.
Is it because Tom Mazza knows everyone and has advised and helped many companies and associations and could bring back members?
Or is it because there bid was lower then the others?
Can anybody help me make sense of the new calamity.
Would SCOTT or any of the board who voted for LCT like to tell the members (who care) what really happened.How about posting the way the vote went!!

As I said before, the NLA has been trivialized. It is losing members who are going out of business and is otherwise not a force to be reckoned with in the industry. NLA isn't sending out renewal bills under the guise that it is "helping" members get back on their feet financially - hooey! It's because NLA doesn't want to deal with the reality of how few members it really has left. People can ride this sinking ship if they want, but it doesn't change the basic fact that this ship is doomed. NLA is like a nymphomaniac at a frat party that gets passed around to whomever is next. Do we care anymore? I think not.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

If I was on the board I probably too would not vote for LCT. The partnership that the NLA and LCT has together would seem to be a conflict of interest. We should have a company with ZERO ties to the NLA. Also "GUEST" why do you not register and show who you are. It seems that people on this site who make accusations hide and do not show face. Who won the bid anyways, it sounds like you "GUEST" have an inside to the situation.

It sounds like the board is actually thinking for a change. Anyways I think that this could actually be a POSITIVE sign with the NLA. I know that myself as an outsider would consider LCT as a bad choice for the reason that I have mentioned earlier. I can also add that many people would agree with me.

A negative with the NLA that I have is that Why has the membership not been told that this vote was even being had. This is the first that I have heard of this. Who were the candidates. The membership should have known and given the opportunity to respond to the candidates.

Everyone knows who Guy is. On the substance of all of this, everyone seems to miss the point. The only reason NLA needs a management company is that the board is too dumb to hire the people directly to run the association. As to the board starting to think - I thought I smelled smoke. When they start thinking, we're all in trouble. Remember, if brains were dynamite, the board wouldn't have enough to blow their nose.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by nkokas:
If I was on the board I probably too would not vote for LCT. The partnership that the NLA and LCT has together would seem to be a conflict of interest. We should have a company with ZERO ties to the NLA. Also "GUEST" why do you not register and show who you are. It seems that people on this site who make accusations hide and do not show face. Who won the bid anyways, it sounds like you "GUEST" have an inside to the situation.

It sounds like the board is actually thinking for a change. Anyways I think that this could actually be a POSITIVE sign with the NLA. I know that myself as an outsider would consider LCT as a bad choice for the reason that I have mentioned earlier. I can also add that many people would agree with me.

A negative with the NLA that I have is that Why has the membership not been told that this vote was even being had. This is the first that I have heard of this. Who were the candidates. The membership should have known and given the opportunity to respond to the candidates.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

if this is true it sounds like a communist arrangment when the government owns the newspapers .. . in this case, Lct could serve as nla's propoganda machine and print all kinds of nla articles. if the nla is caught in any wrong doing i wonder if lct would print it? probably not. the conflict of interest is so overwhelming i cant write anymore

Thanks Jim
Scott we are waiting, remember the scarecrow, the lion and don't forget the Tin Man they took down the big powerfull OZ.

I don't think LCT would try to hide much anymore as you always have the Digest crew you could get to fight them with.
I repeat, Tom Mazza would have been a great spokesman for the NLA.

LCT has dominated NLA since its inception. If LCT managed NLA at least we could get around the sham that we are "members" and simply call ourselves what we are - "subscribers." Add the dues to the subscription price and you get one of the most expensive magazines anywhere. By the way, what service has NLA provided to you lately? NLA is financially busted. It's over - finis. The end is no longer near - the end has come and gone.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

the North American Limousine Association!

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Maybe this forum will get fun again, so I have some simple questions for any NLA board member.
Wasn't an oversite committee put together earlier this year?
Who was on this committee?
Wasn't it done to keep members informed so nothing would be hidden?
How did the vote for the management company go, who voted for who, shouldn't the members know?
Will anybody from the NLA give some answers.

it wasn't the "oversight" committee, it was the "undertaking" committee. Maybe NLA will transform itself into a funeral car association.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Big Pompinsiero:
Maybe this forum will get fun again, so I have some simple questions for any NLA board member.
Wasn't an oversite committee put together earlier this year?
Who was on this committee?
Wasn't it done to keep members informed so nothing would be hidden?
How did the vote for the management company go, who voted for who, shouldn't the members know?
Will anybody from the NLA give some answers.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

going down faster than ever. AA 587 went down without a tail - NLA is going down because it has no head.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JHJ:
going down faster than ever. AA 587 went down without a tail - NLA is going down because it has no head.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Don`t you think your quote was a little bit tasteless Jim?After reading hundreds of your Posts,I did not think you`d use something like this............

A lot of us are not in the NLA; we don't have a clue what everyone is talking about.

Can someone clue us in and give us the factual synopsis of recent events and avoid any unecessary commentary?

Thanx!

http://www.limos.com/media/limos-logo.gif

Please contact Cabarmela Maria,she will bring you up to date on the discovery progess.

A new Managment company has not been selected yet. Discussions are being held with the first choice. Contracts have not been signed. Details will be coming soon. Film at eleven.

John Sinibaldi
NLA Board Member
Chair Vendor Liaison

http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Stupid me remembers some of the promises that were made during the past election about keeping the members informed. I guess it was just more garbage. Any of the current NLA Officers or Directors want to respond so that we might have an idea of what transpired?

Some questions:

Who were the bidding companies for the NLA contract that Host no longer wanted? (I wonder why they bailed out?)

Who were the finalists?

What were the basic details of the final bids -
staffing, location, dollars, etc...

Who voted for each of the finalists?

Shouldn't this information be available to the members or are we back into the big secrets game.

First I see my buddy Big Pomp dropped the Pussy not to offend anyone, gee you shouldn't be so testy.
As I said before tell me up to this point what the NLA has done?
Oh yeah they helped in Detroit because they weren't strong enough to do it themselves, whatelse?
Michael, Host communication elected to not bid for a new management contract to run the NLA. This would only happen if there was no money to be made (0000) or if there was no communicating with such a divided Board and they realized membership was declining. (guys like John, Scott can not do it themselves)
LCT / Tom Mazza put in a bid, I can not specify all they brought to the table but it was good (if Scott or John would like to disclose this)as they were for LCT. Most that did have information that this was taking place was very much in favor of LCT. As was said before in this forum, I also felt that Tom Mazza would have been a good spokesman.
It is now interesting to hear John say a decision was not made, I believe the vote was 9 to 7 against LCT.
Why don't somebody else tell us why Scott stormed out and left the show early!
You know something else, it could really get ugly if LCT or Mazza decided to really align themselves with TLPA, I would pay to see that fight. Gut tells me LCT now tells NLA to go pound sand! I also don't think enough will change with the next election, Scott and John don't have enough horses in the barn and didn't expect that some of those horses would turn and become jackasses (so much for empires).

I received an e-mail today from Sara at LCT who say's the final vote will not be cast until next week and NLA has narrowed down the finalists to two, including LCT and Association Management Company. No final decision has been made, although LCT did finish in 2nd position rather than first. Given the fact that LCT is tied to NLA for at least the next three years in the Vegas Limo Show and has a much more comprehensive knowledge of our industry, LCT may still prevail.

Does anyone know who Association Managent is? Just curious.

Wade Randolph

Ragu you have some interesting comments but the vote was 7 to 5 for AMC, one person did not vote one wasn't there and one was allowed to call in a vote.
Battles continue.
Wade not much is known about this other company mostly because not many new this was even taking place.
LCT might be tied in with NLA for the show for now.
Gotta go for now

First of all LCT is atill alive for you guys that really understand how they would be a benefit to the NLA. It doesn't take mental giants to figure what was going on even when LCT had the better bid. Remember Ty Bobit was a creater of NLA.
For Nick that it seems to bother when people don't use the own names, it doesn't matter as these guys know whats going on in the industry and there giving information to educate others. As Jim said Guy is known by many and does alot for the industry if you want to know more call me.

I have no idea who GUY is. I may have missed something somewhere in the past but sorry I don;t know who he is. I must be retarded http://limos.infopop.cc/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

The main reason that I'm upset is that I have not been informed being a paying member of the NLA of what's going on. I had no idea that this vote was taking place. Is LCT the best choice? I DON'T KNOW. WHY? because I dont know who the other candidates are. What are they each offering? I'm just saying that being a person looking at this from the outside with no other info it seems that LCT would NOT be the best choice. There are many others that feel the same way. Am I right? I don't know because my national association won't clue its members on the logistics of the vote.
Have a nice day!

JHJ whats your states associations name and contact info?

Ty Bobit & LCT are dedicated to our industry. However, only a sub-moron or a soci would credit InfoUsa or Dun &Bradstreet as the source for the numbers in our trade. DIGEST was created because the WIZARD had retired ) WIZARD 1-310-379-4590, or csutton@ucla.edu ) I obtain official lists wherever they exist, and supplement with regional yellow pages and census agents. This is the methodology that Maury Sutton and I used. DMV Records are easy to obtain if you are a reseacher, not if you are an idiot. There have been over twenty thousand operators since 1997. LCT and Mr. Ty BOBIT are an integral part of our WONDERFUL INDUSTRY, I cannot and will not ever support bogus stats and numbers from any magazine in the TRADE that has given everthing to me over 25 years. Sincerely, DEAN SCHULER
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I received an e-mail today from Sara at LCT who say's the final vote will not be cast until next week and NLA has narrowed down the finalists to two, including LCT and Association Management Company. No final decision has been made, although LCT did finish in 2nd position rather than first. Given the fact that LCT is tied to NLA for at least the next three years in the Vegas Limo Show and has a much more comprehensive knowledge of our industry, LCT may still prevail.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[This message was edited by Viperion Corporation / Limos.com on November 25, 2001 at 11:21 PM.]

While Dean Schuler attributed his last post as a "quote" from me, I would like to clarify that I did not post those words, with the exception of the very last sentences. I have no idea what Dean is talking about as there has been nothing in this thread regarding the number of operators in our industry or who said what about determining how many people were in the industry. Can you please clarify what you are talking about and properly attribute the quote. Am I the only one who see's this post as off subject and bizarre? Maybe I've had too muh time off for the Thanksgiving weekend and fell behind in the conversation.

I think what Dean is saying is that we shouldn't entrust the industry trade association to a magazine publisher that uses D&B or InfoUSA to complete industry census info.

This accounting methodology is faulty therefore perhaps we should not trust LCT do run the association. That is what I read into it.

Unless, Deano just wants to reactivate that old hotly debated topic about how many operators exist.

http://www.limos.com/media/limos-logo.gif

Thanks for editing the post by Dean and the clarification of the message. I just wanted to further clarify that I neither support or oppose LCT as the management of NLA. I have been quite candid on this forum and LCT's that I consider LCT the bible of the industry. Everytime I express an opinion like this, I am bombarded so please spare me people. It's just my own personal opinion. I see a plus and a minus to LCT. However, anything is better than what is in place now. The NLA is nothing but a joke. However, if I want to farm a job out today to another state, I don't call NLA, I call LCT. If I want an opinion or advice, I e-mail people at LCT who are quite responsive and informative. There simply is not a better publication or information source in our industry (just MY opinion again!). As for how many operators there truly are, who cares? I don't. It has zero affect on how I operate on a day to day basis.

I guess it's time for me to weigh in with my two cents. I admit to being uninformed on the management issue, but this is a result of the board intending not to open this issue to the members. Informally, no one is going to tell me what the relative advantages and disadvantages are because my position is well known - that it's a waste of members' money to hire a management company to do the same nothing that a staff working directly for NLA can do equally as well. It's a corollary of the mathematical axiom that any number multiplied by zero is zero - it doesn't matter how you manage NLA, the net result is still ZERO. LCT seems to do what it does as well as anybody does it, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they are suddenly in the association management business. There is a big downside to LCT trying to rescue the drowning NLA, but I think that the "near-miss" LCT had with Host trying to take away the Las Vegas show spooked them and they see taking over NLA as the lesser of two evils. From their point of view, I certainly understand that. If I was on-board the Ship of Fools that is the NLA board of directors, I guess I'd try to protect my ass also by trying to run the boat. NLA is a lot like Afghanistan, if you really think about it. There is almost nobody you can trust, decisions are made purely in the self-interest of the tribal chiefs (individual company owners), you can get stabbed in the back as easily as you can be looked at, and most of the members (and, derivatively, board members) never learned to read or write. Into such a vacuum came Osama bin Laden - whither LCT rush in where angels fear to tread? LCT may be able to prop up NLA longer than the alternatives, but not for the long-haul. This Ship of Fools ran aground a long time ago, and only now are people starting to realize that it is doomed.

James H. Joseph
Pegasus Chauffeured Motor Cars
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
jhj@pegasus-pittsburgh.com

Sorry gang I got ragged on for not using my handle (besides I like it)
Big Jim has some valid points, but if the NLA thinks they need a mangement company LCT should be the one.
Besides they might be the only one left!!
An insider at AMC informed me that there was some words with Cory "Rockin" Rozen, something about deferred payments. Another thriller in Manila coming here (where is Cory?)Is LCT the only remaining horse on the track?
Alright Jim, Guy, Ragu or John "Sinbad" Sinibaldi somebody want to take this to the next level or just a brief comment on what happened.
Come on boys let them know.....

It was officially announced by Sara McLean from LCT last night that the contract has been executed. The NLA is now under the management of LCT and Tom Mazza has been assigned to head the operations from New Jersey. The contract was signed on Friday. Sara advised that LCT is concentrating on their upcoming show and once the show is over, they will be focusing full attention on making the NLA the best it can be for our industry. Hmmmmm. Now, I might even join.

It would have been nice to inform the members of the NLA of this new management change.

Wade Randolph